Sunday, December 1, 2019

Part 6 with all the interviews with the parents of Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon


The missing Dutch girls in Panama
part 6 - interviews with the families of Kris and Lisanne

 See the main article on this disappearance case hereSee follow up part 2 about the swimming photo here and part 3 with the diaries here. Part 4 with the latest case updates can be read here. Part 5 highlights what other people think has happened to kris and Lisanne. And here you can read my reviews of some books about this case. I share publicly available information here about this disappearance case, as well as other relevant theories and views. I also wrote about other missing hikers here, and here you can read the findings of Lee Zeltzer in this case. 

One of the earliest interviews with the parents from Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon 
Dates from April 5th, 2014.
 (Source). I have added English subtitles to the video. You can view it here:


Below I wrote out the things that are said in this interview:
Hans Kremers: "Uhm... the moment we last were in contact was.. Monday I believe. And I know that Stephan, Kris' boyfriend, last had contact with her on Tuesday, 14:00 Dutch time [08:00 Panamanian time]. And that is the last message."
Roelie Grit: "It was at 14:00 local time in Panama."
Hans Kremers: "Oh, 14:00 local time in Panama, ok."
Interviewer: "And how was she doing then?"
Hans Kremers: "Things were good. They were having a good time. They were very cheerful and enthusiastic about everything they were experiencing and seeing there. They were excited about things.
Interviewer: "And you said that they had all sorts of plans for the rest of the week?"
Hans Kremers: "Well Saturday [March 29th] they arrived at their host family and ... and then they had planned to start doing volunteer work at the school on Monday. But then it turned out that the staff of this school were like 'Huh? We expected you next week'. So then they had a whole week to fill. And this Monday they started to make plans for the rest of the week. And we know that they continued making these plans on the Tuesday. We know that they looked online about things to do in the area. And they booked some tours, for the Wednesday, the Thursday and the Saturday."
Interviewer: "What was the first signal for you that something was wrong?"
Hans Kremers: "Well we thought to ourselves; gosh she isn't responding. And by Wednesday we decided to send another message. Asking her how she was doing and asking her to send something back to us or to let us know somehow. But we received no answer to that. And I think that the parents of Lisanne had daily contact with her. Yes. And they also could not get into contact anymore at that point. And they started to call.. to Boquete... No? Oh no, you have been called from Boquete then. But then we received a phone call from Peter, Lisanne's father, at night, saying they were missing.... Yes...."
Interviewer: "Do you have plans to go to Panama?"
Hans Kremers: "Yes, by now we are starting to think about that yes. Initially we hesitated because.....what were we supposed to do there? We worry about getting in the way of investigators, not knowing the language, nor the area... so who are we to think we could find them sooner than the local guides there. But today we have been discussing that we do like to go."
Interviewer: "What may have happened to them, you think?"
Hans Kremers: "Well... that is a question I would rather not speculate about.. All sorts of things could have happened. And clearly something hás happened. Or else they wouldn't be missing now.
And something bad has happened to them. Whether that means they got lost, or had an accident or.... it could be anything.
Interviewer: "[mumbles..] encouraging signals.."
Hans Kremers: "Well, encouraging signals in the sense that everyone in Boquete Panama is busy and preoccupied with their disappearance. And everyone is actively searching for them. And I do get the impression that they are using every tool to try to find them. I mean... helicopters are flying round there, 25 people are looking for them. Today another 20 volunteers were added to search for them... They are trying to get this case covered on a local radio show, which all the Indigenous tribes there listen to... So to me, those are all positive signals that everybody is doing everything they can to find Kris and Lisanne. And you also received messages... for instance a young men has gone missing in that same area for 4 or 5 days... and he turned up safe and sound in the end, because there is enough water in that area as well as fruit. So those are hopeful things. Yeh..."
Interviewer: "And how is the cooperation going with Foreign Affairs?
Hans Kremers: "Excellent. Foreign Affairs have taken this disappearance serious right from the start. They are easy to reach, we can always call them. Well, Lisanne's father can tell you the same in a bit. Very cooperative. And the fact that the Dutch ambassador has also been in Boquete - or still is - to keep the attention on this disappearance and to ensure that the helicopters are used. Yeh, great.

Peter Froon: "Last Wednesday night we were called, around midnight, by a school teacher in Boquete. Who wanted to tell us that both the girls had not returned to their host family. We took that for factual information, and then called Judith from Het Andere Reizen [travel agency that offers volunteer work abroad] on the emergency number. Initially her response was that perhaps they had just gone out for a bit, and that surely it would be alright. But she started making phone calls to Panama nevertheless. And at that point it became clear that Kris and Lisanne had been missing for over 24 hours already. That was when all the alarm bells started to ring, and we realized that something serious could be going on. That was when Hans called us about filing a report at the police.

Interviewer: "Yes because if I understand it correctly, you had until Monday or Tuesday [day of the girls' disappearance] contact with your daughter every single day?"
Peter Froon: "Yes. Pretty much every single day we had some form of contact, even if it was only short. Last Friday we had Skype contact. She was very cheerful during that contact. Everything went well. She looked well. There was no indication whatsoever that something was wrong.
Interviewer: "And how is this for you; like I already asked Hans, do you have any internal doubts about whether or not to go to Panama?"
Peter Froon: "Yes we did have that discussion. I have fear of flying.. and we also wondered; what more can we do over there.. But our son and two others, a good friend of his and her brother, instantly said that they would go to Panama. So, with that I had my peace."
Interviewer: "So they are on their way?"
Peter Froon: "They departed this afternoon at 13:15. And tonight they will arrive there. One sleepover and then tomorrow they move on.
Interviewer: "To Boquete.. And I hear that many people are searching for them, also volunteers: do you have the feeling that everything is done in order to find them?"
Peter Froon: "Yes, we certainly do. Because it is a difficult search area. We have the feeling that all the possible means are used now in order to search for them.
Interviewer: "Uhm... I understand that you only knew each other from Schiphol? [From bringing the girls to the Dutch airport].
Peter Froon: "That's where we saw each other for the first time. Kris and Lisanne are friends. They also live together in the same [student] house. They also work together in town. And they came up with the plan for this travel together. And we first met at Schiphol when we said goodbye to them.
It was very nice. In high spirits. And we will stay that way [full of hope]."

Something I picked from this interview:
Roelie, Kris' mother, says that that last contact with Kris was on the day she went missing, Tuesday April 1st, at 14:00 PM local timeThe families were prepared for this very important first TV interview. I get the impression that Roelie knows exactly what she is talking about when she corrects Hans on the time. I think we can rely on them having done their homework beforehand and being certain when that last contact time was. Pretty important detail after all, and it would be easy to retrace such info with the phone of Kris' boyfriend at hand, which I am sure they did in those frantic first hours and days after finding out that their daughters were missing in Panama. But mobile phone contact at 14:00 PM makes no sense with our timeline, because the girls were already behind the summit by then (going by the times on the photos).... So this poses a direct problem with the information we have at the moment. Because if we go by the times on the digital camera photos, then Kris and Lisanne were near the first stream beyond the Pianista summit by then. Which is about an hour down from the summit, and also an hour away from the last point of mobile reception with any cell tower. Kris' parents walked the same route later and confirmed that once you descend beyond the summit, your phone no longer has any connection. So how is it possible that Kris' boyfriend Stephan last had contact with her around 14:00 in the afternoon? This interview was very very early, only several days after the parents learnt about their daughters disappearance. Memory will have been fresh still, then. But how could this information possibly fit in with the official story we have been sold? If they were at the first stream, pictured on photos 507 and 508, at 14:00? Does this mean that the photo times are incorrect after all? Was the taxi driver Leonardo right after all when he stated to police that he dropped Kris and Lisanne off at the start of the trail at 13:40 that Tuesday? In that case, Kris could have had contact by phone with Stephan, while doing the first part of the ascend; an area with cell phone reception. This timeline issue has never been really solved. I wrote extensively about it in part 1 of this blog series. Either you believe the taxi driver (later murdered) and the staff of the language school, who all place Kris and Lisanne after 13:00 and before 14:00 that day on the Pianista Trail. Although one staffer later changed her story and said in private to some investigators in the 'community' (by now) that she last saw Kris and Lisanne in the Spanish language school on the Monday afternoon in fact; not on Tuesday 13:00, as she and Marjolein previously had told owner Ingrid. As far as I know, Marjolein still stands by her statement however. But lately Juan has published new material in this case, including a swimming photo of Kris and Lisanne. Scroll down this blog post for a lot more information on this topic. The swimming photo is not dated, but shows (in my opinion very clearly) Kris and Lisanne swimming with two local youth, who both died relatively soon after under very suspicious circumstances. My own theory has since been that Kris and Lisanne were not alone at the Pianista Trail. That there were people with them, and that the witnesses who said they saw Kris and Lisanne at the trail head again around 15:30 PM that day may have been right; that the girls took a taxi (the one of the later murdered Leonardo) and went swimming afterwards. Either they had arranged to do so with the lads in the photo (having met them on the Sunday for instance, while out and about in Boquete), or they may have met them there. But going by the warm sunlight in the photo, my bet is that this photo was taken in the later afternoon. And because neither of the girls ever mentioned the event to their parents, to the massage lady they spoke to for 1,5 hours on Monday evening or to their host family, and because they also did not mention a swimming event in their diaries, I think it is likely that this swimming trip took place on Tuesday afternoon. After that swimming photo was taken, something went wrong.. Perhaps they didn't return affections which caused anger; maybe they were offered a lift but never brought back to their host family; maybe some other scenario took place. Problem now is that if Kris indeed had contact with her boyfriend Stephan around 14:00 on Tuesday, then the official timeline can not be correct. There was no cellphone reception beyond the summit. But if the (previously defended by me) old timeline is correct, and they started their hike shortly before 14:00 that day, then there is no time window left for them to make it to the point of photo 508, ánd return back to the start of the trail again, ánd have time left to drive to the Caldera area for a swim. You can't have it all, in other words. So which scenario is correct here? I asked Juan for help:

Juan: "Yes I have the same problem, I also believed in a late hike but indeed, I also prefer to let this hike end in Caldera [the swimming event].. But it is all possible, if you let them do that Pianista hike only briefly. Yes this is a very big stretch of the imagination, considering all we have been told and think to know now. But don't forget that there seems to be something going on with a lot of those summit photos. They may not even have been there, theoretically. What if those witness stories are correct, and they did return soon after, and Lisanne was really too sick to do that whole long hike? And then afterward to Caldera to swim.. A very difficult puzzle, because you would even need to doubt that Kris ever really stood at that distant stream from photo 508. Besides, some witnesses have  said that Kris and Lisanne were in Caldera on March 30th and 31st... So well, maybe the swimming photo dates from before April 1st. But then.. I really do not know anymore, you also have zero certainty as there are no hard facts it seems.. And then you have your own personal favourite scenario's also. Like for us that the Caldera swimming photo was their last, and that they ended up in that area, far away from the Pianista trail. But that doesn't necessarily have to be true. Even while sticking to my firm belief that those night photos were taken in the Caldera region". [..] Yes, "Leonardo Gonzalez the dead taxi driver claimed, he dropped them off at the Pianista restaurant, at 13:40. Cell phone reception was no problem then.. while all the witnesses can be correct as well, they returned around 15:30 again.. And the rest of the Pianista hike is a smoke screen illusion, manipulated by the perpetrators. Camera times only became an issue, after June 14. And then they even needed to be recalculated. And the reports are pretty useless then, in my opinion. It's just, whose side are you on... the report, with the times and phone usage, manipulated by the perpetrator.. Or the boyfriend of Kris, who recites a very fresh memory, and who probably checked it thirteen times and showed it to the parents etc.."

My take on this: "Regarding the many people who believe that Kris and Lisanne had an accident: I just think that there is no evidence for this. I think the basis of it all was that a lit up leaf in one of the night photos, was described by Jeremy Kryt of the Daily Beast as the possible outline of Kris' body, down in a ravine. Now that we have mostly all the nighttime photos, we see that same leaf shape from different angles and in fact, it is just a leaf lit up by the flash. Not the outline of a body. That should put an end to the Kris-body-accident theory. But it doesn't. People still believe it. In fact, another reason for this is probably because on day 5, Kris' iPhone was no longer received the correct pin codes. That could indeed indicate that she was no longer conscious or in a good enough state to remember or tell them. It can also be a tactic and a purposeful red herring by a 3rd party however. Both are still an option. Another possible reason why one of the girls 'must' (may) have died sooner than the other, is the different states in which their very few bone remnants were found. Kris' seemingly long dead, because her bones were bleached and completely bare, also containing phosphates. Lisanne's bones in a much earlier stage of decomposition (and a rolled up ball of skin from her leg was even found 5 months after they disappeared, also in a very early stage of decomposition). This could indicate that she died much later than Kris. Or it could in fact indicate that someone stored her remains in a cool and dark place, and dropped them shortly before they were found. We just don't know for certain!  -  What makes me personally doubt an Accident scenario, is the fact that a small army of people were looking for them in a relatively small, inhabited area. Every single blogger I read about who hiked this route, ran into multiple people every single day. Also while they were deep into the wild and away from the Pianista Trail's summit; even when they walked all the way to Bocas on the coast, they ALWAYS met other people along the way. Farmers with their cattle, Indigenous people and children, tourists, guides, you name it. Nobody mentioned even one day of pure solitude there. So to think that Kris and Lisanne spent days, even a week, near a monkey bridge (passage for many people), alongside a river where houses lay that are inhabited, while having a bounty on their heads of 40.000 dollars at some point to be found, is to me beyond any logic or credibility. And if they fell in a ravine or something, then this most likely happened near the summit of the Pianista trail which has the highest mountain ranges; those places were literally combed through by many, including sniffer dogs from the Netherlands. They weren't there. Yet their bone remains were found at a distance of more than 14 walking hours up north from this area. Nobody with a broken pelvis and shattered foot would walk that far (and walk willingly or knowingly away from civilization, not towards it). I just don't think the facts in this case can make for a convincing Lost scenario..."

'Kris and Lisanne must be found'

May 3rd 2014. - INTERVIEW "The friends Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon should have returned from a wonderful trip through Panama last Tuesday. But the reunion with their parents at Schiphol did not take place. The families are doing everything they can to find their missing daughters and end the nightmare.

'When Lisanne and Kris return from Panama, she's in for a blast. The whole of Amersfoort will come out to celebrate their homecoming, it will be a warm bath'. A smile appears on the lips of father Hans Kremers when he talks about the moment when he will see his Kris again. 'When the time comes, Kris and Lisanne won't know what hit them'. Diny Froon nudges her husband: 'Peter sometimes says that he is afraid that he will hug Lisanne to death when she returns back home.'

But Lisanne and Kris aren't home. The Amersfoort friends, aged 22 and 21, seem to have disappeared from the face of the earth in Panama, the country where they would learn Spanish together and do volunteer work at a daycare center. They planned their trip down to the last detail. Learned Spanish songs and games to keep the kids entertained. Put together an itinerary. The sporty, somewhat introverted Lisanne and her crazy, spontaneous friend Kris would have a wonderful time.

Black Forest
Father Peter was very proud to be at Schiphol when it was time for Lisanne's departure. He and his wife Diny never traveled further than Germany's Black Forest. 'Make the most of it,' said Diny. 'Have fun,' cried mother Roelie Grit, flanked by Hans. When the four parents had a cup of coffee at the airport, they exchanged phone numbers. But we won't be needing them, they thought. Cheerful messages from Panama follow. They Skype. And then, in early April, in the middle of the night, Diny gets a phone call. She hears how a stranger asks for Lisanne. Diny explains that she is Lisanne's mother. She then understands that her child has not returned to the host family where she is staying with Kris.

'I was very shocked, but you immediately try to put it into perspective.' It won't be that bad, they'll show up again, she tells herself. But they need to find Kris' parents' phone number. In the middle of the night they find out, that Lisanne and Kris have already been missing for more than 24 hours. That's why they haven't heard anything lately. 'You explode when you understand that something is wrong,' Hans Kremers says about that moment. "But pretty soon your emotions are blocked." Because a call must be made to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. A report must be filed. It must be ensured that everything is done to find Lisanne and Kris. Roelie and Hans Kremers leave for Panama to help with the search. Roelie: 'We wanted to be there when Kris was found.' From their home in Amersfoort, Diny and Peter Froon help where they can. All four parents assume that the girls got lost during a hike near Boquote, the place where they are currently staying.

Other scenario
But now that the area has been scoured and no trace of the girls has been found, they assume a completely different scenario. A dark scenario, in which their daughters are taken against their will. It doesn't change their task, they say from their couch in Amersfoort. Their daughters múst be found. They cán be found. That's what they hold onto. But every morning they have to deal with that same hammer blow again. The two young women are not there. They find the strength in each other to continue searching, in spite of this, but in particular from thinking about their children. Still, they don't imagine where Lisanne and Kris are right now, or what they're going through. The parents cannot afford to spend energy contemplating horror scenarios. Hans: 'We have to remain strong for the girls, to find them and help them when they get home. That is our motivation, that's why we keep going.'

They prefer to focus on the Find Kris and Lisanne Foundation. The whole of the Netherlands can help to finance the search, by depositing money. The number of responses is overwhelming. Sometimes small amounts of 1 or 2 euros are donated, because the giver cannot afford to lose any more money. Peter: 'That's so moving.' The messages written with the deposits warm the hearts of the parents, who have so much to bear. "Take courage." "We sympathize." Diny: 'That keeps you going; it is a helping hand.' If someone speaks about their daughters in the past tense, as if they are no longer there, it is very difficult for Roelie. 'We don't want that, because we in fact have the confidence that they are still alive. Those times in the day when I make myself completely free to think about her, I get such a warm feeling. Then I have conversations with Kris, then I feel that we are in contact.' Then Roelie just knows that her daughter is still alive. 'If Kris was no longer out there, it would feel different."

Peter R. de Vries, crime reporter, and Martijn Froon's beliefs regarding the disappearance of Kris and Lisanne
Een Vandaag April 11th, 2014 + later interview from November 21st 2014

EEN VANDAAG, April 11th, 2014:
Local: "We assume and hope that the girls returned once it got dark. And that they have gone in the direction of a beach. It is really necessary that the searches are increased."
This criticism comes from a local guide, who helps the police looking for Dutch Lisanne and Kris. And this same afternoon the Panamanian police declared that the searches for the girls will continue until at least Sunday. But that the search operation will not be further expanded. With me in the studio is crime reporter Peter R. de Vries. Well Peter, no new discoveries and the search will continue until Sunday... These girls have been missing for ten days now. What does it tell you that the searches are prolonged until Sunday?'
"Well to be honest, that sounds a bit economical and frugal to me. I would expect a statement in the order of; for now we will continue to search, as long as we haven't found a trace of these girls. I know from experience and from other cases, that it is exceptionally difficult to find in these type of surroundings. I know cases where searches continued for weeks and weeks, and nothing was found in the end. Only to find the bodily remains half a year later. And such a case ended fatally."

Presenter: 'And what about this new criticism that the searches should be expanded?'
Peter R. de Vries: "Well I am inclined to agree with that. Two girls have disappeared and there is no trace of them. Everything also points towards them not having disappeared voluntarily or that they went elsewhere. All their belongings are still there [in their room]. Well then you have to use all the available means, including tracking dogs."
Presenter: 'Let's look at all the events that took place so far.' 'April 1st. As far as we know now, Kris and Lisanne started their hike on the Pianista Trail as late as 3 PM. They were seen by witnesses. "Around this time they went up the mountain." That evening, the two girls don't return to their host family. Clothes that would have been necessary for a long hike, turn out to be still in their room. Nothing points towards them having planned to stay away for long. It is not until the next morning that a guide, who was supposed to take them for a guided mountain hike, raises the alarm
Guide F: "Once we realized they hadn't spent the night at their host family, we reported them missing as soon as we could." 'On April 3rd, the families of Kris and Lisanne go public. They create a special facebook page. 
Hans Kremers: "Something has happened that isn't right. And if that means they got lost, or had an accident, or I don't know..." 'In Boquete, Panama, the search operation becomes more extensive. But police have yet to find a trace.'
Search member: "It is very cold at night and we are very worried because the girls did not wear appropriate clothing."

Dutch Ambassador in Panama Wiebe de Boer:
 "We are very content with the cooperation with the Panamese. They have put a lot of people on this case right from the start."
'The parents of Kris are meanwhile in Panama.' 
Hans Kremers: "Everybody who here in Boquete and in the whole of Panama is busy with this... It feels really good. And I am convinced that they will pull out all the stops." 
'More than a week after the girls went missing, sniffer dogs are used for the first time. 
Arturo Alvarado: "But unfortunately the weather is poor. That makes the search more difficult."
'And yesterday and today the search continues in vain with the help of Indigenous people who know the area.
Local: "Here the search for the missing girls has not stopped for a moment. Their disappearance touches us deeply."
Presenter: 'Yes, back to crime reporter Peter R. de Vries. You already said, the approach seems a bit frugal. Until Sunday they have searched. What is your impression from the approach of the Panamanian authorities? They know the area, they use the help of locals. Do you think they do well? 
Peter R. de Vries: "Well, like I just said, it is very difficult to search in that terrain and the guide has said that it ís easy to get lost in this area. And you have to keep in mind: imagine that these girls did in fact get lost .. and it gets cold there at night, then it is possible that they searched for shelter from the cold in a cave or a crevasse. And if you then are caught up by the cold that night, then you are hidden there, more or less. And this prospect makes the search more difficult."
Presenter: 'Shouldn't we also consider the worst scenario; a crime?' 
Peter R. de Vries: "Yes, it is certainly possible that it was foul play. It remains speculation for now. I myself am inclined to think: they were together. One person alone can slip and fall in a ravine for instance and then it is difficult to find this person. But for this to happen to both of them, that is less likely. There is usually one left to look for help. Who can follow another trail back. And that is seemingly not the case here. And then you have to consider the possibility that a 3rd party had a hand in it and that they met foul play."
Presenter: 'Exactly. Back to those searches, do you think there are consultations between the Panamanian police and justice department and the Dutch? 
Peter R. de Vries: "Well, if that is the case it will be minimal, and a bit of a formality. Look, if it is about a drug cartel, they will always contact the Dutch and ask with what type of people they are dealing here, and ask for more information or a dossier. But these are completely innocent girls. They got lost over there, everything happened over there. The Dutch police can really do nothing, in my opinion."
Presenter: 'The Dutch do say: Listen we have sniffer dogs, searchers and special troops available. When can we send them over? Does something like this happen more often?' 
Peter R. de Vries: "Of course you would have liked to do that yesterday already. Every minute almost counts. But we also have to trust that they have some experience with these things over there, and that people get lost more often there. And that they need to be searched for. So they should be able to do this." 
Presenter: 'Yes, thank you, Peter R. de Vries. 

I translated a new video, an interview from April 2014 with Lisanne's brother and uncle, which you can find here. I will write out parts of this interview below

April 28th, 2014
Pauw & Witteman, interview 
with Martijn Froon and Jan Rigter

Interviewers Jeroen Pauw and Paul Witteman ask: "Martijn, can we go back to the first moment when you realized that your sister.. that there was no more contact? When was this?" 
-That was on Wednesday night, April 2nd. I received a call from my parents at 00:30, saying that Lisanne hadn't returned to her host family. [This was technically the very early morning of Thursday April 3rd Dutch time, Scarlet]. My parents said that they would wait and see for further developments. because the communication with Panama didn't go very smoothly. For all we know they had gone to a party or something. So well, I went back to sleep but with uncomfortable thoughts in the back of your mind.. And at 05:00, so a few hours later, my parents called again to say that they were at the police station in Amersfoort to file a missing person report. And then you know... something is really the matter. And we also found out later that they had been missing for over a day and a half at that point." 

"What was your own last contact with your sister?" 
-"That had been on Sunday [March 30th]. A simple Whatsapp message, saying that they had safely arrived in Boquete. Because they had first visited Bocas del Toro. At the coast. And that was it really. Very casual.
"It's all a bit remarkable, that your parents had to go to Amersfoort to report her missing." 
-"But my parents live in Amersfoort." 
"Yes, yes, but you would think: what can police in Amersfoort do about it?"
Well, they had to start somewhere. And at the police in Amersfoort they could activate a network. Interpol was informed right away. And they have set up international contacts.. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs was also involved. And they have made the contact with Panama to start things. [..] I also know that the Dutch ambassador there, Wiebe de Boer, drove that same day from Panama City to Boquete to spread the word and help set up the investigation and guide the searches. 

"Initially, during the first day or the second day, is there also still a feeling that oh well, perhaps they just met someone and that they attended a great party and that we worried for nothing?" 
-"Yes, that is of course what you hope to be the case. But when the days pass by, you start to realize that something is really the matter. 
"Maybe it is good for you to tell us what sort of woman your sister is. Then it is easier to judge what she would and would not get involved in, so to speak."
-"Well that's the thing: they wouldn't just go to a wild party. Or disappear off the radar, only to show up a few days later again. They would never do that. They planned this trip weeks in advance. My sister had made a list and the weekend before she went to Panama we all sat in the backyard and she told us: 'That's when I'm going to do this and this and then that.' 
"She had everything planned." 
-"Yes, all planned. And I was initially like: I do not have to know all of that. But she really liked to tell us all of that anyway. And I think it tells you how well-prepared she was for this trip." 
"And how about her friend? What sort of woman is she?"
-"I don't know her very well. I mostly know her through my sister's comments. As far as I know, she is also not a very exuberant type. And with the two of them, they would have had to make decisions together abut the things they wanted to do."

"You brought a map along and that is the type of map which they probably also have in their hands. Not this actual map but the same copy. And when you look at it... there seems to be no danger hiding in this map, right? It all looks very relaxed. With drawings and such. These are routes which you can walk there." 
-"Yes it is a schematic representation of the town. Mainly a lot of green". 
"Can you point out on the map what the route is which they, going by the latest information, have last walked?" 
-Well here lies the town itself. It has some restaurants. Here is where they ate something that afternoon. Then there is a route which goes here and then moves up... When you take this trail, it is about 3 to 4 kilometers. It ascents steeply and there are also a lot of houses situated next to this trail. Then here is Casa del PedroThis is the last point where they have been actually seen. By someone who talked with them. And we know 100% certain that this is where they were last seen." 
"And that was during the day, no strange weather..."
-"It was around 14:00-14:30, in the afternoon. They wanted to climb the Pianista trail. But they ended up on the wrong part. That's when the man there said: you can also climb the trail here. Is also nice and it is a shorter route. Because the Pianista route takes a good 3 to 4 hours before you reach the summit. [Scarlet: by now the consensus is that it takes on average 2 to 3 hours to reach the summit]. And it was already later in the afternoon then. You don't have a lot of daylight left. Then they walked up that route [Piedra de Lino] and then descended again 15 minutes later. Because there was road work there. I have walked up there myself and I have also seen that they were working on the road with excavators. You could not walk any further. Then they sat on the pavement there and asked this man what was the fastest way to get back to town. And he told them: that is the same road back down again, with a taxi or on foot." 
"And that is what they did, you think?" 
-They sat on the side of the road; that man saw them sitting there from his kitchen window, after he gave them this information. Hundred meters from there was a kind of kiosk. He confirmed that he saw Kris walking. A smaller girl with red hair, fitting the description. But from that moment on, nothing is certain anymore." 

"You went there, not that long ago. You returned last week. Also to check, I assume, if the reports from the Panamanian authorities about their great searches there were correct. What was your impression, Mister Rigter? [..] And also good to mention is that you are a former cop."
"I know how things go and this was also an opportunity to see how things work over there and if police there indeed did what we hoped they would do. [..] I have the feeling that they searched very thoroughly. They have especially searched the start of the trails multiple times. They have then extended those searches to all the places where they may have been. They used dogs which are trained to find living people. So not dead people and also not with the help of pieces of clothing. No, specifically living people.And they also used helicopters for the searches for several days. So the authorities did everything they could to find the girls. But unfortunately they didn't.
"And then the first period is the most important they say. So the first two days. Is it known what could have happened to the girls in this time periods?" 
-"No. At that point there were several witnesses who thought that they had seen the girls on the Pianista trail. That's why so much manpower was used to investigate a disappearance case on the mountain. But later, when they found nothing there, they started to focus on another scenario." 
"Mister Rigter, I already said it in the announcement but you have been a cop yourself. When you look at this from your professional background and knowledge, what is your qualification for the work that is being done there?" 
-"I think that the Panamanian colleagues have done a good job. They have done what they could. They were supported by someone from the Dutch national police force. And when we as the family said something, they immediately anticipated on it and investigations were started to see if we were right or not." 
"Has this investigation been so thorough, that you would say that the chances of them being found there are minimal? They are no longer in that area?" 
-"You can of course never exclude that possibility completely. Because the surroundings are rural. There are many houses with large gates there, because a lot of pensionados live there. Other people can live there as well, people with a lot of money. And they could of course easily hide the girls there, if that is what you mean." 
"Is that the scenario you have in mind?" 
-"Uhm.. That is a possibility. To hide the girls there, if you would want to. And to search every house there: there are 3000 or 4000 houses there. You would need a good reason to turn someone's entire house upside down." 

"You both have.. what have you done there actually? Because you walked that trail, up until the last point where your sister has been in any case, as far as you know. And was there anything else you could do there? Anything your heart told you to do, of use?" 
-"Quite a lot actually. There are stories circulating about Panama being corrupt and the police force not being effective there. And the police would not be doing good research. Well first of all, we never experienced this. But there is a part of the population there, which does not like to talk to the police. Because they are afraid of consequences. Which may have been realistic ten years ago, when the police were not doing so well then. But that is why the local people there rather talk to family members or other locals than with police. So we have been advised to go out there, to go and talk with the locals in the hope that they will talk to us. And once these people see that the family is in town, then that stirs a certain emotion in them. And the people there are very much driven by emotions."
"Did this bring any results?" 
-"No. Unfortunately not. I did talk with a lot of people there. Maybe 100 or 150 people, face to face. And I could see that each and everyone of them was affected and touched by the situation. I only had to say that I am the brother, and they would know who I was and what was going on."

"[..] Do you think you have to go on then because you believe they may still be alive?" 
-"That is what I believe. And what I hope." 
"And you believe this too, Martijn.."
-Yes, of course that is what I hope. It is difficult to comprehend, because there is not a single trace of them. Because there are still so many scenarios possible. There is not yet one direction I lean to and this uncertainty makes it difficult. This allows for your thoughts to go in directions where you don't want to think about." 
"I understand that. But if they are not in this area..  Uhm.. how do you look at this as a former cop? Sorry that I keep saying that, but how do you look at this? Does it come down to you eliminating scenarios? Like, this is not the case, so then by deduction we end up with this?" 
-"I think that you always keep every option open. Because you can always receive a tip from an unexpected direction. Of which you say: we will further look into this." 
"Ok, but let's focus on the positive here and assume that the girls are still alive. Then they could only realistically have been kidnapped. Or kept somewhere against their will. Whatever you want to call it."
-"Look, if you call it a kidnapping then we would have expected their captors to have contacted us by now to demand ransom. We have not received this question. So you may assume that they are perhaps being held somewhere, without having the possibility to leave.

Scarlet: **So.. The uncle is careful with his phrasing and says that kidnapping as a term does not fit the bill here, as there was no ransom demanded. But he also says that Kris and Lisanne could have been taken against their will and held somewhere against their will. I guess in English one can call that an abduction. I had the impression that this option was kept open during this interview, an abduction with sexual/criminal motives and not ransom motives. A crime of opportunity, which happens so very often in all parts of the world. It is rare for such criminals to ask for ransom. I understand very well that the uncle is careful with choosing his words on national TV. He is a professional and cops use jargon often and - like in law - need to be careful with choosing precise terminology.   -  I was surprised that the uncle brought up the big gated houses of rich people, and that there are so many there in Boquete. They weren't checked, not thousands of them. He says in effect that without an official warrant or a pressing reason, police could not start to demand access to all those gated big properties. In this case, the police went after tips. They did not have the capacity or the power to knock on random people's homes or gates and demand to check the property without good reason. So most of those gated places or boarded up houses along the area were never checked. Don't forget; this is a police force of which Erik Westra, former Dutch cop and living in Boquete said that they are basically only qualified to write out speeding tickets. Being paid in cash please, thank you ma'am. They had one police car in town, ten years ago. Things may have improved a bit by now but this is still not a unit that approaches the FBI in any way, in terms of manpower and quality. They couldn't record a couple of fingerprints, they couldn't check the places of suspects with forensic teams or luminol. Nothing. It came down to whatever tip they received and they would or would not go after it. Even the tour guide has told the press that the police needed to start checking empty houses. Ingrid Lommers said the same in the media; that the police had to start checking deserted and locked up houses. But police mainly responded to tips from the public. They did not go past all the houses in that village to send dogs in to look for traces of the girls. But Lisanne's uncle, ex-cop, confirms in this interview that if someone had them locked up safely, deep into a house with large gates, then unless someone snitched on them, they wouldn't have to worry about police demanding to search the place any time soon..    

And then there is the red truck, which Martijn here dismisses as a fantasy. And indeed, the involvement of a red truck is nothing more than a rumour. According to Betzaida Pittí. Not everyone will agree with her however, and we do not know if 'her' red truck (a red Toyota carrying plants, of which one magnificent witness remembered the entire licence plate according to Panamanian police, on April 1st when there was nobody missing yet) is the only red truck that came down there that day. It may have indeed been the plant/flower dispatcher who witnesses saw, but many people had and still have red pick up vehicles there. It could have been a dead end though, surely. And then there is Pedro's detailed witness statement and interaction with Kris and Lisanne, which was considered truthful at the time (Martijn even says it is "100% verified" information). Ingrid Lommers even went to Pedro's hostel and pointed out exactly where Pedro had seen them sitting by the road. It all seemed verified. Until the moment the backpack and camera were found on June 11th of 2014. Then all the witness statements and all this information was overhauled by the data on the digital camera and phones. It is extraordinary how the media and investigators and even the families ran with Pedro's information, right until that point. And then his info was simply discarded. Easy as that. But perhaps there is a time window possible on Monday, between roughly 14:00-16:40, when Kris and Lisanne may in fact háve met Pedro and walked the Pedra de Lino trail behind his hostel. (He would have been one day off then, saying he saw them on Tuesday). For Monday morning their phone data already pins Kris and Lisanne down at the language school and then having lunch somewhere, but that afternoon they may have gone up the trailhead. They would not have taken any photos then, however. Which seems out of character for them.

In this video, the parents of both Kris and Lisanne are invited to a Dutch late night TV show (RTL Late Night) when the girls have disappeared for one month, and talk about the investigation and details about the case. 

May 1st, 2014
I tried uploading the video with added English subtitles on my (renewed) youtube channel, to add it to some other videos on this case which I already translated in English with subtitles, but unfortunately this is yet again a case of copyright blocking. Bleh. Although in some countries it may be visible. I know that counties like the United States and Brazil are blocked from viewing it however, so I'm forced yet again to upload the show in parts directly on here. (Like with the Break Free TV item on Lisanne, which you can watch within the blog post here, if you scroll down). It's the only way unfortunately for English speakers to follow what has been said in this case. The videos all work, you just need to press the white 'play' triangle in the middle 2 or 3 times. 

Episode in full:

Episode in parts:




There are some interesting things said in the video I thought. Firstly, Lisanne's mother says that before Lisanne went to Panama, she went through a very difficult time. I wonder if this was due to her volleyball injuries, preventing her from doing the sport she loved? Or because her father had endured a stroke? Even though that was quite a few years ago by then.. Or due to other private reasons perhaps? Mum doesn't elaborate however. On public forums, there has been some information shared about some form of intimate abuse by someone, which is really shocking to be honest and unverified. So it may be fake news and someone trying to act importantly perhaps by sending such a message out there. But it made me feel even more for Lisanne and Kris (if that is even possible because I already think about the girls' plight a lot); if one of them went to Panama to recover in some way from a tough period at home and from such an ordeal, and then ended up in the worst hell imaginable... 

At some point the presenter asks the parents: "What I am wondering is this: was this case [of missing backpacker Alex Humphrey - see part 1 of this blog post about his case] discussed in Panama? Because 5 years ago his son disappeared under the same circumstances in Boquete... Well... is that a coincidence? Has this scenario been taken into account? That someone else has also gone missing there?" Kris' parents reply: "We didn't hear about it when we were there... No, we haven't heard about it, and that scenario also hasn't been taken into account. What we have heard in fact, and what we also saw with our own eyes, is that Boquete is really a very calm little place really. And we constantly saw young girls and women, alone or in pairs, walking in the streets. Also in the evenings. And there was no one there who said: that's not wise to do. Or; would you really do that?" 

Summary on Alex:
 In August of 2009 a British backpacker, care worker and poet named Alex Humphrey went missing while hiking the same area around Boquete, one week into a three week holiday. Alex vanished, aged 29, after checking into a local hostel. An experienced hiker, his family believes he was a victim of a crime. But he may have also just fallen victim to the jungle elements. Despite several police searches, a Panamanian media campaign and the offer of a $5,000 reward, no clues to his whereabouts emerged. Just like Kris and Lisanne, he just vanished into thin air apparently. Not a single bone of Alex was ever found. Which makes some people think that instead of getting lost, Alex may have run into a criminal gang of sorts, used for his organs perhaps, but most certainly made to disappear for good. No body, no murder case, after all. Dutch Ambassador Wiebe de Boer (a useless diplomat and door mat in our Kris and Lisanne case) made the shocking comment that Alex was autistic most likely, so well... there you go. As if it was therefore his own fault that he disappeared. Alex will always remain that 'missing person' now..

The parents from Kris retraced her steps and are very clear about it;
after the last known photo on day one (picture 508) they say that there is no way to get lost on that path, whether you walk on or turn around back to the summit. For hours on end there are no ravines or cliffs you can fall in. There are no other roads you can be mistaken with and get lost on for hours and hours after that last photo point. They are very clear about this: down the mountain there is only one trail to follow initially. One clearly visible trail without exits or crossing roads. No way to get lost. So there are only really 3 sensible possibilities for why Kris and Lisanne called 911 several hours before it got dark that day: first, one of them had a mild injury, an ankle perhaps, or asthma flaring for Lisanne perhaps. Second; they realized they wouldn't make it back to Boquete before dark. Third; they ran into the wrong person or crowd and were afraid. I'd say the 3rd option is most likely. Because if one got injured mildly, then the other could have gone back to get help, if not on day 1 then certainly on day 2. And the same goes for the 2nd scenario: they could have made it back on day 2, as it was only about 3 hours tops to walk back at that point. I don't believe two healthy athletic strong young women both got injured on a one way trail, surrounded by rock walls, where you cannot fall into a ravine. And both perished in the jungle while they were still so close to Boquete. And since we know they started making emergency phone calls on day 1, when it was still light, that is an indication that something had gone wrong early on.

And had they been at that rock alongside the river, next to the monkey bridge, then they would have been found.
It lies right on a road leading back to the Pianista path and Boquete. And this trail and the monkey bridges are used by people; locals, Indigenous people, searchers.... I don't buy that they were there for 11 days and nobody found them. The same for their belongings: there's no way the backpack and remnants wouldn't have been found in the initial searches if they were there. They were planted there, in my opinion. Nevertheless many people following this case do think that Kris and Lisanne got injured or lost their orientation and ended up on that rock, taking the nighttime photos themselves in an attempt to signal help troops which they assume searched in the dark of night. Now there is no evidence whatsoever that teams kept searching after midnight. The helicopters most definitely didn't fly in the middle of the night. I don't exclude that they were on that rock during the night of April 8th, but I don't think they got lost and ended up there by their own account. (Am leaning more towards them running into foul play and escaping that night). Some other problems with the scenario in which they simple got lost after April 1st and stumbled towards that spot near the river, possible injured, are that many of the other questions aren't answered with it:

1. How did they end up there? These rocks near the monkey bridge lie next to a road that brings you straight to and from the Pianista summit and Boquete. They could have just walked back, so it's unlikely they were truly lost. And as the parents showed in the video; for hours after the place of photo 508 you can only follow one clear trail; no ways to get lost, no diverting roads and no cliffs or ravines to fall into. So if they weren't forced by a 3rd party, why would they call emergency services while it was still light, and continue walking further away from Boquete?

2. How is it possible that nobody found them there, for days, weeks? These rocks near the monkey bridges are on a main path that has been searched by the army, Sinaproc, local guides, volunteers, dogs and helicopters. Even locals use these routes regularly, and yet nobody found them there? Near impossible if they were just taking refuge along the river. Even some tourists who knew about the case and actively looked for them and who passed those exact places in the end of May 2014 ensure their readers that the girls were not there and that they saw nothing, no girls, no markers, no clothes, no backpack there.

3. If they were there, injured, how did their (few) bone remains end up many kilometers up north, scattered, upstream? There were no bite marks on the bones found; no animal markings, so they couldn't have been the ones dragging the bodies kilometers apart. And the whole notion that they fell into a river and that the water carried their remnants along seems fairly ludicrous too. A river cannot be at the same time strong enough to tear young healthy bodies apart, yet carry a simple non-waterproof backpack as if it contained Moses in a basket. (Leaving everything inside unharmed) There's also no way that shallow river with so many rocks in it would have dismembered and cut up these young women's bodies within not even two months time. It's much more logical that they could then have gotten themselves safely out of the water, if they even fell into it at all. But even so, it would have left marks on the bones found; marks from rock indentations, from dragging damage. Yet they were squeaky clean. No markings whatsoever were found on the bone remnants, not even microscopic ones. The bone marrow was dry also, pointing away from these bones having been in water for a significant period of time. And how did the remains end up kilometers away on the land, in the jungle then? Upstream? It makes no sense at all.

4. If they were free out there, why didn't they take more photos or call home? Eleven days at least out there with a functioning, charged digital camera and two functioning mobile phones, yet not a single call attempt to reach their own parents. No more photos, no pictures of important markers along the way to help them retrace their route. No selfies, no video message on their digital camera. I find it impossible to explain, unless a 3rd party prevented them from doing so. If they were free to call, why has there never been a call attempt made in the evening or at night? The only reason I can think why their own beloved parents were never even tried to call, is that a 3rd party was in charge and didn't even know who in the address list were the parents.

5. If they had 'just' gotten lost, how to explain the missing photo 509? The girls had no technical know-how or interest it seems, as during all their weeks of holidaying, they always used the default camera settings and never even zoomed in their lens. They didn't delete a single photo of the 200 or so made. Yet this photo 509 was not just deleted once, but deleted so thoroughly that investigator specialists with the best software in the Netherlands couldn't even find back as little as 1% of the original image. Nothing. Which they link to a computer removing the photo from the memory card. How can this be explained if the girls were just out there, waiting for help on a rock?

-If Kris was still alive after April 5th, why didn't she just give her PIN code to Lisanne? Why were there at least four wrong code/no code entry attempts after the 5th?
-Why was there a peculiar preference to call in specific time blocks: between 10:16 and 10:53 AM and then between 13:37 and 13:56 PM?
-Why was not a single video recorded with the digital camera and why were no more photos made between April 2nd and 7th?

Video with Peter & Diny Froon and Ingrid Lommers; "Please know that we will stay here in Panama until you have been found. We will wait as long as it takes. We will stay here to find you."

May 13th 2014. As I have said all along: the parents of Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon were not going anywhere, as long as the fate of their daughters wasn't found out. In this Dutch TV program from Een Vandaag (May 13th 2014), Peter Froon literally says "Dear Lisanne and Kris. Please know that we  will stay here in Panama until you have been found. We will wait as long as it takes, until you are found. And we will not give up! We will keep looking for you, for as long as it takes, we will stay here."
Presenter: 'Diny and Peter Froon still have hope that this case will have a good ending. Since their daughter and her friend Kris went missing, they have now traveled to Panama for the first time. Een Vandaag followed them.'
Diny Froon: "Please, leave us no longer in uncertainty. And please give us a sign of life."
Presenter: 'Diny and Peter fight against their tears on the press conference with the Panamanian media. They are distraught since their daughter Lisanne vanished without a trace with her friend, about six weeks ago.' 
Peter Froon: "Dear Lisanne and Kris. Please know that we will stay here in Panama until you have been found. We will wait as long as it takes, until you are found. And we will not give up! Really, we won't. Have faith in us, we will keep looking for you, for as long as it takes, we will stay here."
[Scarlet: The parents would never give up or leave, until something was found that gave them closure. Hence why I believe that the backpack and bones were planted mid June; to ensure that the parents would finally leave]
Presenter: 'The Panamanian media has come in large numbers. The mysterious disappearance case is still in the news here. In the street everybody knows who we are talking about, when we start about the Dutch girls.'
Local: "It is a worrying situation, because people have disappeared. Even though they are not from Panama, it still touches us that they are missing. We pray to God that they are doing well and that they will be found soon."
Presenter: 'On Wednesday April 2nd the alarm is raised when Lisanne Froon and Kris Kremers don't return to their host family in Boquete. A mountain village in the west of Panama. A large forest area is meticulously searched. But to Kris' parents great disappointment, nothing is found.' 
Hans Kremers: "But we are convinced that if there would have been a trace of them in these mountains... that these men and women would have found it."

"Please know that we will stay here in Panama until you have been found. We will wait as long as it takes."

Presenter: 'Last weekend, Lisanne's parents Peter and Diny also travelled to Panama. They are supported by two family members. It is the start of a difficult journey, to the place where their daughter was last seen alive. 
Diny Froon: "You now start to look at everything as through the eyes of Lisanne. And you think: this is really where she has been, and what has she seen here? And of course we have seen the images on TV, but to see it all for yourself here is overwhelming.  
Peter Froon: "Of course it is difficult to keep faith. Especially as time goes by. But as long as the opposite hasn't been proven, we keep believing that they will be found. And that is where everybody is working towards, and that keep us going. Even though it is sometimes hard."
Presenter: 'The rain season has started in Panama. There are several theories about what may have happened with the two Dutch women. Did they get lost on the Pianista? A popular hiking trail in the mountains. Did they step in the car of the wrong people? And what happened during the last day? We get in the car with Ingrid Lommers. The two girls followed a language course at her school. 
Ingrid Lommer: "This is the most direct route to the Pianista. They wanted to learn Spanish and they really wanted to work with children. They had really good intentions, for themselves and for the local population. And it is so unbelievable that something like this happened to two girls, who came here with such good intentions. Why did this happen to them? Why on this moment and in this place?" 
Presenter: 'Ingrid takes us to Casa Pedro. Probably the last place where Kris and Lisanne were seen.'
Ingrid Lommer: "One of the two girls has sat here, the other stood here. And they had the intention to return to Boquete. And they sat here for a little while. The mister from Casa de Pedro has seen them here. And at some point they were gone."

"One of the two girls has sat here, the other stood here. And they had the intention to return to Boquete. And they sat here for a little while. The mister from Casa de Pedro has seen them here. And at some point they were gone."

Manolu Ruiz (mayor of Boquete): "I think they went somewhere else. We searched in the mountains but have found nothing." 
Presenter: 'Do you think that a crime took place?' 
Manolu Ruiz: "I hope not. I only hope that they are still alive."
Presenter: 'By now there are said to be new signals about a possible breakthrough in the case. It is not clear what signals. 
Diny Froon: "It is more like a rumour that we heard. And we want to check everything. To find out if we can find a trace in these rumours. If they are true or not."**
Presenter: 'Jan Rigter, Diny's brother, has travelled with them to Panama, together with his wife. For years he worked for the Dutch police but he also knows that in countries such as Panama, you need a private detective to really get to the bottom of things.'

'For years he worked for the Dutch police but he also knows that in countries such as Panama, you need a private detective to really get to the bottom of things.'

Jan Rigter:
 "First there are the tips that could come in through the offering of a reward. The police doesn't do anything with these tips, so you need someone who will verify them. The private detective can do this. Sometimes you also receive tips from psychics. Which could be correct perhaps. And then you try to link those to the facts that are known. And the police often does not have the time to properly investigate this."
Presenter: 'The reward for the golden tip has by now been increased. And this has to open up the naturally closed-natured Panamanians. 
Diny Froon: "But then we need certainty within the next three weeks, about where the girls are and that they return to us alive and healthy."
Diny Froon: "It has to happen here. So we really want this to make it to the national papers here. And the people already talk about it, but the coverage has to get even bigger. Because here is where it has to happen. There must be people here who know something. And this is how we want to encourage people and to convince them to make contact when they know something. To give us tips we can work with." 

"And there are plans from us to constantly have one of our families present here from now on. We will stay present here, until this is solved. We don't want to leave them alone." 

Peter Froon: 
"And there are plans from us to constantly have one of our families present here from now on. We will stay present here, until this is solved. We don't want to leave them alone."  
Presenter: 'And Tros Vermist has raised the reward for the golden tip with 1000 euro. That program will give attention to this case tonight.' 

**As for the rumour: I think it was this event which the Froon's referred to in this TV interview. A peculiar tip was checked; around this time, and reported on on May 16th 2014:  "Two bodies are said to have been seen near the spot where the women disappeared. Police release a map with the spot where the bodies are said to have been found, which coincides with an area called Culebre, near the cable bridges and the river crossing. Representatives of  the Panamanian prosecution are sent to the spot, but bad weather prevents the helicopter from landing. They do circle for two days around the area and when the representatives do eventually arrive there, they find nothing. Shortly afterwards they state it was a 'false alarm' from an anonymous telephone tipster, who called the police with this 'information'. No money claim was made. Which is a strange extra detail, considering there was a reward of 40.000 dollars for the person who found the girls, and it kind of excludes the possibility of the tipster being a gold-diggers trying to troll for the reward. But in this article it is reported that the radar of a helicopter did in fact notice two skeletons. Note that this region was already highlighted on May 16th, while the girls' backpack and bones were found much later, respectively on June 11th and 18th.. In the same area as marked on this May card regarding the location of these potential bodies. Unfortunately the hard to reach Culebre region has not been searched by Dutch sniffer dogs (who were trained to find living people), as they will not be allowed to go there in the upcoming week. On a Boquete forum, a person named Allan wrote that "Both Panamanian and Dutch dog teams found no scent, as well as no kind of evidence or trace of the girls on the trail which they were reported seen entering on, which has led local searchers and Government officials, on both sides, to conclude that the women had never been on the mountain." 

Vermist interview

May 13th, 2014
Vermist, interview 
with Roelie Grit and Hans Kremers

Interviewer Jaap Jongbloed ask Kris' parents: "Where do you find the strength to go on and to continue to believe in a safe return of the girls?" Roelie replies: "Firstly because I have the feeling that they are alive. So I hold on to that. And secondly, I have trust in her, to have the strength to do the right things. And I think that the same applies to Lisanne. And further, the people around us are very important. There are so many people who give us support. And that is not just your own inner circle, but also the rest of the Netherlands. It is fantastic, it is a massive support for us. 
-"They are tough and independent young women, these two right?"
Hans Kremers: "Yes. They are responsible girls and they have confidence. So that strengthens the idea that they would not do any silly things. And that in their current situation, they will choose the best survival strategy possible. 

-"What is the situation at the moment? A lot of searches have been conducted. I assume that they are no longer wandering around in the direct surroundings. What is still happening there in terms of search operations?"
Roelie: "Well the center of gravity of the investigation has shifted by now to a police investigation. It is by now a criminal investigation. Because that is the leading scenario by now. That they somehow have been taken, have been forced  to go somewhere and are held against their will. So that is where the focus lies now. And we have stepped away more from the scenario which we first believed to be true: that they got lost. 
-"Now you can also say, in retrospect: shouldn't they have sooner considered a crime the most likely cause? Or leave that option open?"
Roelie: "Initially the emphasis was placed on these searches in the jungle. But that does not mean that they didn't also think about the possibility of foul play. The police in Panama has from the start played with that possibility as well. But not as intensely as now." 
-"So I get the impression that you have been content with the way they have been dealing with the investigation there so far."
Roelie: "There has been a large deployment of police there. At some point another team was put on the case.. which is more specialized in crime, so to speak. People with a higher rank also. And we are of course very happy with that. We do expect result from having the best people from Panama working on the case.
Hans: [..] "As time passes, the news value drops of course. But for us the news value never decreases, of course. So like Peter just said during the press conference in Panama: we will continue until we have found them. And the attention for this case, the foundation and the donations we receive enable us to maintain this. And it enables us to stick to these promises to our daughters. 

-"A reward has been offered of $30.000. And we have added another €10.000 to this amount. Do you truly think that this can help to bring the golden tip closer?" 
"We think so yes." 
"Do the police and investigators think so too?" 
Hans: "Yes. Yes. Yes we have also been advised about this. Look, first we thought that $2500 was a good amount of money to motivate someone to make that two day hike from beyond the mountain to come say that you have seen something. Now that we think that the disappearance is linked to crime, we think that $30.000 is probably a more attractive sum to for instance report someone from within your direct circle of acquaintances." 
Roelie: "We like to speak directly to the people in Panama. Try to imagine what it feels like to have your daughter, or your sister, or your loved one missing. And to not know what is happening to them. Try to imagine this. And try to gather the courage. Because we realize that it is very difficult to start to talk about these sort of things. We understand that very well. But please, help us. This is about the lives of our girls."

Mother Lisanne: 'Where are they, where are they'
May 16, 2014
Carla van der Wal

In this old interview with the parents of Lisanne are interviewed by Dutch newspaper AD - The parents of Lisanne Froon, who is missing in Panama, go from one emotion to the other during their search in the jungle, noticed AD reporter Carla van der Wal. One moment they are amazed at the beauty of the wild nature, the next moment despair strikes.
Mother Diny Froon: "One moment I see the beautiful color of a bird, the next moment the tears come flowing. In the evening, when it gets dark and when the beautiful landscape disappears, I have it really tough. Then I wonder: where are they, where are they stuck?" Her husband Peter has this one question continuously spinning in his head: "What happened? It is incomprehensible." Lisanne's parents traveled to Panama last Saturday. During their first press conference in Panama on Monday, they openly called for more information about their daughter (22), who has been missing since April 1st, and her travel companion Kris Kremers (21). In front of the many cameras they emphasized once again that a reward of $40,000 has now been offered for the golden tip. The money was collected through the specially established Find Kris en Lisanne foundation. During their first press conference in Panama, Monday, they announced a call for more information about their daughter (22), missing since April 1, and her travel companion Kris Kremers (21). In front of the many cameras they emphasized once again that a reward of $ 40,000 has now been offered for the golden tip. The money was collected through the specially established Vind Kris en Lisanne foundation.

False tips
Since the emotional appeal of Diny and Peter Froon [and the announcement of the reward money, Scarlet], the police in Panama has been inundated with false tips about the missing Kris and Lisanne from Amersfoort. "People want to collect the reward," says district head Julio Lasso of the police to AD reporter Van der Wal. "And so there are many false reports. People say they saw two bodies, but then they cannot give a precise location." The tipsters hope that after their tip the bodies will be found by chance and they can receive the reward. "Still, we check everything," says Lasso. 'We want to find the women. As soon as a tip comes in, we will have a look. Always. And we will continue to do so until they are found. '

Since the emotional appeal of Diny and Peter Froon, the police in Panama has been inundated with false tips about the missing Kris and Lisanne from Amersfoort. "People want to collect the reward," says district head Julio Lasso

Blue t-shirt
One of those tips yesterday led to searches in the Cordillera de Talamanca, a mountain range in the border region of Panama and Costa Rica. An anonymous tipster stated that he had seen two bodies 'in a state of extreme decomposition'. The search operation, for which a helicopter was deployed, yielded nothing except for a dirty blue T-shirt with a tear or a hole. It was found on the edge of a ravine, according to Panamanian media. The newspaper El Siglo, which published a photo of it, called the shirt "a possible clue leading to the place where the bodies of the two women are." According to Lisanne's parents, the shirt is not their daughter and neither of her travel companion. Diny and Peter Froon are in Panama for the first time. At the beginning of the disappearance case, Lisanne's brother and an uncle were in the Central American country to monitor the searches closely. Lisanne's parents now want to see for themselves the place where their daughter disappeared, learn about the investigation and want to give it a new impulse. Kris Kremers' parents have already been to Boquete, but have since returned to the Netherlands. On Tuesday evening they launched a new call for information about their missing daughter and her traveling companion.

My daughter was kidnapped!
May 29, 2014
La Prensa

All thanks to Juan for finding this article and translating it. An interview in Panama with the parents of Kris. "Kris Kremers' parents believe that their 21-year-old daughter was abducted by strangers in the Chiriquí mountains."
"It's 8:00 a.m. on Wednesday, May 28 and the parents of Kris Kremers, instead of working in Amsterdam, observe how four rescue groups board several vans to enter the mountains of Boquete, on the trail of their daughter who disappeared and has been missing since April 2nd. Surrounded by an idyllic passage full of flowers and green mountains, Hans and his wife Roelie take cover from the cold (about 17 degrees Celsius) and walk around the camp where twice a day the authorities meet, to share clues about this case. It has been 59 days since they last spoke with their daughter, who, accompanied by his friend Lisanne Froon, came to Boquete to learn Spanish and work in a nursery. After eating some fruit for breakfast, they give a 15-minute interview to La Prensa to publicize a profile of their daughter and the theories they have about his disappearance. The trust that 25 years of living together generates, means that each question is answered by both of them.

-How would you describe your daughter?
"Kris is an extrovert, creative and very friendly girl. She is very sociable and makes friends easily. In college she studied Fine Arts. With this profession you can work as a guide in any museum. In September she will start studying a postgraduate degree in Art History.
-Is she your only daughter?
No, she's the one in the middle. She has an older brother who is 24 years old and one younger brother who is 18 years old, who are currently in the Netherlands. She was born on August 9, 1992. I am not clear on her friend Lisanne's date of birth, but I do know that she graduated from her psychology study.
-When did your daughter decide to come to Latin America to study Spanish?
We (the Kremers) traveled together two years ago to Peru and that is why we found it interesting and good that she decided to study Spanish in Latin America. The decision was made jointly with Lisanne, whom she met four years ago at the restaurant in the city of Amersfoort, where we live and which is located at about an hour from Amsterdam.
-Why did she decide to come specifically to Panama?
At the beginning of this year, she and her friend began to select a destination in Latin America and found out that Boquete offered, in addition to Spanish classes, the possibility of doing social service work, taking care of children in a nursery.
-What was the route they chose to get to the country?
As they are students, the cheapest option was to fly from Amsterdam with a stopover in the United States. So they first flew to Houston and then to San José, where they stayed one night. After that, they traveled to Isla Colón in Bocas del Toro, where they stayed for a week and finally arrived in Boquete on Saturday, March 29. Every day we talked to them. We communicated by email, WhatsApp and Skype."

My daughter was kidnapped! I don't know by who, but I'm sure she was kidnapped.

The meeting with Kris's parents takes place on the sofa in the restaurant where they set up a tent as an operations center. Officials from the National Police, the Red Cross of Panama, the Fire Department, the National Civil Protection System (Sinaproc), the Directorate of Judicial Investigation and the Prosecutor's Office come and go to this place. Since they were reported missing, local authorities have traveled all possible routes, using even helicopters. In fact, a group from Sinaproc, after walking for 44 hours, arrived in Bocas del Toro starting from Boquete. The novelty of the search this week is that the parents managed to bring to Boquete a team of Dutch volunteers with tracking dogs capable of finding people both alive and dead. The capacity of these dogs is such that they are capable of sniffing bones and human remains in shallow rivers and up to nine months after the disappearances are reported.
-When was the last time you spoke to Kris?
March 31 on WhatsApp. They told me they were fine, but they were a bit disappointed because the Spanish school (Spanish By The River) had informed them that they had not gotten the job they had been promised.

-How and when did you find out about your daughter's disappearance?
Lisanne's parents called us at home on the night of Wednesday, April 2 (afternoon in Panama). They told us that they had called the school and that the girls weren't there or gone on a field trip they had scheduled. It was at that moment that we knew that something serious was happening. Ever since, our lives have completely changed. Now we focuses solely and exclusively on finding our daughter. There are good days and some very bad days. There are many emotions. Many at once ...
-Do you have a theory of what could have happened to Kris and Lisanne?
"My daughter was kidnapped! I don't know by who, but I'm sure she was kidnapped." At this point in the conversation Hans, a man of 1.88 meters tall and about 55 years old, gets tearful eyes. Roelie looks sad and tired. The posture of their shoulders is like that of someone who faces with resignation the greatest challenge of their lives.
-How has the collaboration of the national authorities been in the search?
I am very grateful to all the security elements in Panama, who have given all their support, affection and cooperation.
-They have brought in a team of search experts from the Netherlands who will be in the country for 10 days. How much money does this operation cost?
"A lot of money. About 95 thousand dollars. We have opened a bank account here in Panama to receive donations. The idea is that if, for example, tomorrow the authorities need a helicopter because they have found a clue, money will not be an obstacle to stop this search." - The conversation ends and Roelie gets up from the couch to recharge herself by taking a little sun. Her husband does the same and take rolling paper and tobacco out of his right pocket to make a cigarette. A short distance apart, they both look up the same mountain where rescue teams search for their daughter, while Hans drains the stress by fidgeting with the already bruised nail on his right thumb.

Panama calls Kris and Lisanne disappearance a kidnapping
October 1, 2014
Updated: November 08, 2017
RTL Nieuws

[Source] "The parents of Kris Kremers, who died in Panama, say that two forms from the Panamanian authorities state that Kris and Lisanne Froon were kidnapped. The parents of the girl said this in RTL Late Night. "If we analyze all the facts, there is no question of them getting lost", said father Hans Kremers. It is exactly six months ago today that the two disappeared in the woods near the Panamanian city of Boquete. The remains of Lisanne (22) have since been handed over to her parents. The parents of Kris (21) have not yet received anything, neither reports on DNA tests. Investigator Pitti had said that Kris's remains would be handed over at the end of September. The parents still have many questions. For instance about the DNA traces of an unknown man and an unknown woman, that were found on the belongings of Kris and Lisanne. There are also reported that the phones of the women have been logged in about 80 times. This was said by former detective Dick Steffens, who assists Kris's parents. The parents walked the Pianista path in Panama, which the two women are also said to have walked. "We don't think you can get lost there", says mother Roelie Grit.

La Prensa article from late May, 2014; "Kris, We're going to find you!"

May 31st, 2014

Roelie Kremers, the mother of Kris, one of the two Dutch tourists missing in Boquete since April 2, made a desperate appeal yesterday, 60 days after she last spoke to her. "Kris, don't despair, we are going to find you! We're going to find you!" she said in a broken voice to the media present at the operations camp of the search team, that is trekking the Chirica mountains looking for her daughter. Her husband, Hans Kremers, took the opportunity to ask anyone who has any information on the girls' whereabouts to contact the authorities. "We are not ruling out that they may have been taken to Costa Rica; we are not ruling anything out," said Jerome Van Passel, spokesman for the family. Yesterday, a group of rescuers from the Costa Rican Red Cross joined the search for the Dutch tourists Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon, who were last seen in Boquete on April 2. Sergio Flores, head of logistics of this group, explained that they are eight paramedics specialized in rescue, capable of climbing the intricate landscapes of the mountains of Boquete. "This is the same mountain range that we have on the Costa Rican side. We know this type of mountain. We have the ability to sleep in the forest and stay there for eight days without having to go down," he said. If the tourists are found alive in the mountain, they will probably have problems of hypothermia and dehydration, he said. "In Costa Rica we worked similar cases. Eight months ago we tracked a nurse who got lost on Chiripó, the highest point in the country, located at 3,820 meters above sea level. We managed to rescue her alive five days later. She was two hours away from the trail marked as safe. She presented hypothermia and dehydration", he added.

"They did not buy phone chips [SIM cards] in Panama to call with any of the local telephone companies. They only used their phones to connect to the internet via Wi-Fi."

This way, the Costa Rican search team joins the rescue groups that since last Monday have been on the trail of Kris and Lisanne. In addition to a Dutch group of volunteers with dogs, national authorities are also helping in Boquete with the search. These are officials from the National Police, the Panamanian Red Cross, firefighters, the National Civil Protection System (Sinaproc), the Judicial Investigation Directorate and the Attorney General's Office. Yesterday, various sectors of Boquete were inspected, including trails, without the search team finding any significant signs. The tracking work with the dogs will continue until next week. Hours before the arrival of the Costa Ricans, Hans Kremers, Kris' father, confirmed that in the Municipal Personería of Boquete they were given his daughter's belongings. "They already gave us her passport, her clothes and all her belongings", he explained from the rescue operations center located in Palo Alto de Boquete. Meanwhile, sources from the Public Prosecutor's Office told La Prensa that the cell phones of the two missing Dutch women have not yet been found. "They did not buy phone chips [SIM cards] in Panama to call with any of the local telephone companies. They only used their phones to connect to the internet via Wi-Fi. The last connection we have on file was made on Monday, March 31 from the José Domingo Médica Park in Boquete," he added, This park is in the center of the town of Boquete. According to the testimony of Kris' parents, the last contact with their daughter was made on Monday, March 31. "She told me that they were fine, but that they were a little disappointed because the Spanish school (Spanish By The River) had informed them that they did not get the promised job," said Roelie Kremers, mother of this fine arts graduate.

"When you get lost, you usually leave signs in your path. You tie a piece of shirt to a tree or look for a river to drink water. In the searches we have made, we have not found any of this"

Both girls had been in Panama since mid-March to learn Spanish and work in a day care center as volunteers. Regarding the investigation, the first superior prosecutor of Chiriqui, Betzaida Pittí, expressed that during this week they will continue reviewing the videos of the commercial establishments of Boquete. Sources of the Judicial Investigation Directorate (DIJ) indicated that it is not discarded that in the next weeks there will be raids to farms and houses in Boquete"We cannot search everywhere, but we can search in those places that are suspicious because of the profile of the owners", she added. Meanwhile, this newspaper contacted Ingrid Lommers yesterday through Facebook, who was in charge of the Spanish By The River school and who was offered an interview to get her version of the facts. At the same time, a member of the team of rescuers participating in the search commented that the "strangest" thing about this case is that they have not found any trace in the mountain so far. "When you get lost, you usually leave signs in your path. You tie a piece of shirt to a tree or look for a river to drink water. In the searches we have made, we have not found any of this," said the official. [source]

When you talk about them, you do something for them
JUNE 20, 2014
By Kim Bos 

Juan retrieved this old interview with the parents of Kris and Lisanne and their spokesperson, Nikki van Passel, published in quality newspaper NRC  -  "In the course of Thursday evening, Nikki van Passel, the confidant of the families of Lisanne Froon and Kris Kremers, is called more and more often. We are in a cafe in her hometown of Amsterdam and her phone screen flashes continuously. All journalists. "They get wind of something," says Van Passel. It is still unclear of what. "There are rumours." The Panamanian news is already reporting about "human remains" that may have been found. "But there have been rumours like this before," says Van Passel as her eyes slide over her phone. "Don't believe rumours." A bit later she says: "It could be that the story you want to write will no longer be relevant tomorrow." This story had to be about living between hope and fear, about the human primal force that ensures that you can survive in the most uncertain period ever. Van Passel has just driven here from Amersfoort on her motorcycle, where we talked for two hours with the parents of Kris and Lisanne. This may sounds crazy: but we had a good time. The six of us sat at a robust wooden table, with cups of coffee and tea. Diny and Peter Froon and Roelie and Hans Kremers sat next to each other. Photographer Stefanie Grätz sat at a corner of the table and Van Passel sat on the stairs, right behind Hans. Kris and Lisanne's parents made a strong and hopeful impression. Very worried, but not desperate. Peter made a joke about the emotional roller coaster they are on now, and how they deal with it within the family. “One is angry, the other is sad or emotional. But as I understand it, we are now allowed to feel a little crazy.” There is laughter. But sometimes there were also tears. Like when we talked about the period before Panama, a completely different era. I asked if they could still remember what their lives were like back then, when the search for their children did not yet take up all their time; when Lisanne and Kris still lived in their student rooms in Amersfoort. The parents' faces hardened.
Roelie: "You don't want to think about that time. Then you have to really cry."
Peter: "Then the emotions hit you in the face. We've had birthdays, holidays, the weather was nice. We had so many great things."
Diny: "Ah."
Peter: "And she had her room in the city."
Diny cringes and shields her eyes with her hand. Peter strokes her back. 
Peter: "There you go. Don't think about it. ”

Noise on social media
Amsterdam, Thursday evening. After our talk in the cafe, Nikki van Passel would go home, to bed. In 48 hours she had slept for maybe two hours, she can't keep track of it exactly. But when we say goodbye, she hesitates. "I think I have to go to Amersfoort again." All those phone calls. She leaves at 8.30 PM. Less than an hour later, a Panamanian press conference is announced in the Dutch press. Two shoes are said to have been found with human remains. More at 10 p.m. In a text message in which I wish the family strength, Nikki van Passel replies that she is now back in exactly the same place as where we sat that afternoon. And that they no longer understand anything about it. "Hope is gone…" she writes. Nikki van Passel is not a "normal" spokesperson, like those that are often found working for large companies. She is emotionally involved, because she has become attached to the parents of Kris and Lisanne. Nikki van Passel is a social media marketer and would help the families of Kris and Lisanne to make "noise" on social media. Generate attention, as she also did for the family of the missing Marianne Goossens and for Ingrid Visser and Lodewijk Severein. But her involvement has become much more than that. She is also the family press officer and she researches tips that come in. Her Spanish speaking brother Jeroen is in Panama, where he represents the families. "What you see is sleep deprivation," she says when tears are in her eyes during the conversation on Thursday evening.

They saw each other once
Amersfoort, Thursday afternoon. At 3 p.m. Diny and Peter Froon ring the bell at the Amersfoort terraced house of Roelie and Peter Kremers. The mothers go to the kitchen to make coffee and tea. The fathers follow them. They conspiratorially talk to each other. It all feels pleasant and natural. If you didn't know any better, you would think they are good friends. But until April 1, they had only seen each other once, at the airport, on March 15. Their daughters, who knew each other from their work in an Amersfoort eatery, then left by plane to Panama to learn Spanish for two weeks and then volunteer at a daycare center. To be on the safe side, the parents had exchanged numbers. You never know. Diny and Peter Froon had never been outside of Europe and Hans and Roelie Kremers once before. To Peru, where Kris' love for the continent was sparked. Large framed photos of that trip hang in the living room. Even though the girls themselves did not have much travel experience, the parents were not really concerned. Of course it was exciting (nerve-racking), but those girls went on an adventure. It was going to be great fun. And it was. Lisanne was a bit homesick at first, but in Boquete there were lovely children in the guest house and the messages the parents received via Whatsapp and SMS [Scarlet; the girls still used the 'old fashioned' SMS service] were positive. Kris was relieved that the rooms were clean, because she had worried about cockroaches. 

Diny had two thumbs injured from trying to catch a hot casserole with them. Those thumbs were completely bandaged on April 1. She stuck them up, Peter took a picture of it and sent it to Lisanne in a Whatsapp. 

She has not responded to that anymore. [Scarlet; the parents believe that Lisanne and her friend made thumbs up photos on the Mirador in a reaction to the photo of Diny's wounded thumbs]. “Before we start”, says Peter Froon when we have just sat down at the table, “why exactly do you want to speak to us now? Why haven't you approached us before?” The families and Nikki van Passel have already spoken with many other newspapers so far. I say that I think it has to do with the fact that we were afraid to bother them in this difficult time. That we perhaps didn't want to be accused of sensationalism. But that we often talked about Kris and Lisanne, that we wanted to know how the families survive and how the search is going. Peter Froon says they decided to talk with us because they hope we want to write down the whole story. Peter: “At one point I thought our story was presented too fragmented. We would like to tell the whole story so far. And not just highlight the "striking" parts. That is when the background story disappears. At RTL Late Night we tried in early May to tell the story as it was until then. But that was the last time.” 

The story must not disappear, it may not fade away, because if attention continues for Kris and Lisanne, the search may become more intensive, we think.

A strange phone call
The whole story starts on April 2nd at 12:15 AM. Diny and Peter are just in bed when the phone rings. They receive a call from a woman whose name you pronounce as Eilien. Diny Froon: "Do I speak with Lisanne," she said. "We are searching for Lisanne." But she's in Panama, I said. It was a very strange phone call. We sat on the edge of the bed. Then you put the receiver down. That was Panama.” They called back to ask for more information and then we found out that the girls had not been home the previous night. The breakfast, which the hostess had prepared early in the morning, was still there at the end of the afternoon when she returned from work. What do you then do, as parents? Call with the travel agency. Trying to call the other parents, Roelie and Hans, but the number didn't work or perhaps Diny had accidentally switched two digits. Calls with Stephan, Kris's boyfriend whose emergency number was registered with the travel agency. Kris's parents were also reached. At five o'clock in the morning, Dutch time, they all sat together at the police station to report the crime. One night away, they are young, maybe they went out (partying) you can still think at that point. But the town they were staying in doesn't really have places to go out, says Hans. And besides, "They would never go away for so long without letting us know." Three days after the disappearance, Martijn and Jan, Lisanne's brother and uncle, travel to Panama. They're just going to pick them up, the families thought at the time. A few days later, Roelie and Hans also leave for Panama. Hans: “You speak to people who saw them for the last time. You are walking the same trail they walked. How could they have gotten lost? Making posters. Paste posters. Talk to the media there. Create a Facebook page. We were informed daily about the search there. We made contacts. ”
Roelie: “You see two such girls walking everywhere. Sometimes I thought it was them. ”
Diny: “I had the urge to warn them. I found the first evenings very confronting. Then you have a view of the mountains and when it gets dark, you think: wow. You see the village with all those lights and then you think: Oh my god, where are they. After a few days you start to get used to it and you can give it a different place. ”
Roelie: “When you are there you think you are closer. And then you see the scale of the gigantic nature there. It's huge. ”
After 40 minutes, the conversation becomes more taxing for the parents. It's satisfying to talk about their girls - it's only when you talk about them that you feel like you're doing something for them, says Roelie - but it's also grueling. We take a break. The fathers smoke a cigarette in the garden. Roelie is rummaging in the kitchen and then comes out also. Diny isolates herself in the back of the garden.
Hans: “When we find them, I'll organize a big party in Boquete and a big party here.” Hans talks about the warm people in Boquete, who are ready to welcome their girls [when they are found]. They are very involved there. The parents received hundred of thousands of hugs from people who recognized them. Peter is restless and wants to go back there again soon. Roelie and Hans returned last week from Panama. The town is more than twenty-four traveling hours away from the Netherlands. 
Roelie: “Well, I would already be satisfied when I just see her again”, Roelie responds to the comment about her husband Hans' party. “Just ro hold her.”
Peter: “We are going to find them.”
The parents are combative. Photographer Stephanie Grätz sees that too. She asks them to pose like that in the garden. The photos should be about strength and hope. How would they look if they could give courage to their daughters with their gaze?

The whole of the Netherlands is sympathetic
In the most difficult time of their lives, the parents also see the most beautiful side of human beings. The whole of the Netherlands identifies and sympathizes with them. They draw a lot of strength from that. For example, there is the sticker-covered box. 8th grade students had made a memory game for the families, with drawings and texts. Like this one: “Sometimes there are so many things we feel, but so few things we say.” “So much positive energy, something good must come from it,” says Hans about the attention from the Netherlands. Roelie has set up a "table of hope" in their house. It has burning candles and a photo of Kris and Lisanne in Panama, seated on a terrace. You can see that they are having a great time and that offers comfort, the parents think. There is also a card with a blue sea on it that the girls sent from Panama. The card arrived weeks after they were declared missing. That was a real shock. They must remain hopeful. They try not to think in doom scenarios, they say on Thursday afternoon. That is sometimes difficult. Especially when everything goes quiet for a while and they do not speak to Van Passel, the police or the press. 
Diny: “I especially struggle during dinner in the evening and before we go to bed. Then you have received so much information and then you sit quietly. Then all the images start to come in. You don't want that, so you try to push it away. But that does not always work. There are so many scenarios possible. You just shouldn't think about that. Then shivers run down your spine.”
Roelie: “During the day I can handle bad messages, but at night I can't keep it off. During the day I can say: it is not true, and put it aside. But that is no longer possible at night. So then I really struggle with such an article about organ couriers that was published in the AD.” Sometimes they think in scenarios. 

Hans: “There is no question that they got lost, so they were deliberately taken by someone, we know that now. 

Hans: “There is no question that they got lost, so they were deliberately taken by someone, we know that now. And that's where it stops. I consciously keep it at that for myself. That's it. And who that someone is, or who they are and what their motives are, what those girls are going through now, I try to keep that out of my thoughts. It has no point either to imagine all that. I can worry about that later. When we find them again. But now I have to block it, otherwise I cannot function. And then I can't do anything for those girls, when I block I cannot make sure that the investigation continues. That's why you have to stay strong.”
Diny: “It's as if something enters my brain that just says 'stop'. Every now and then something does slip through [into your thoughts] and then you put it away again. Sometimes I can be really sad and then I go for a walk or get an ice cream. Get away from your environment for a while. Maybe they aren't realistic thoughts, but I'm always thinking like: there are two of them. As long as nothing is definitive, it is fifty-fifty. I yell that to myself five times a day. As long as there is nothing found, it is fifty-fifty. I draw strength from that.”
Roelie: “For me, distraction doesn't really work. I turn my thoughts inwards. If it is really bad then I just do a kind of mantra: she is alive and she will be found, she is alive and she will be found, she is alive and she will be found. And I say that consecutively and at a certain point the negative is pushed into the background.”

The conversation in Amersfoort ends at 5.30 PM. Diny and Peter go home, Nikki van Passel stays with Roelie and Hans for a little longer and then comes to Amsterdam, where we go over things a last time. “Something is about to happen. I can feel it”, says Van Passel. It was the same with the other missing persons cases in which she was involved: suddenly there was a lot of news and a lot of phone calls. Human remains have been found in Panama, it is confirmed not much later. "After finding the backpack and other personal belongings of Lisanne and Kris, it is strongly taken into account that it actually concerns both missing girls," Nikki van Passel writes in a statement on behalf of the families on Friday afternoon. "Although it is not yet 100 percent certain that it concerns Kris and Lisanne, the shock surrounding the developments is great and the families now want to be able to process the news in peace." They are going to Panama, but they don't yet know when. All examinations can take weeks, all in all. But we're allowed to print this story in our newspaper is welcome, Van Passel says. It has to be. It's good for people to hear this."

Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon, PanamaThis is a Dutch tv clip of the parents of both girls telling about their attempts to find Lisanne and Kris in Panama and this is their own search there
At the start of August 2014, so four months after the girls went missing, the parents of Kris followed the exact same trail that the girls took, based on the evidence of their location from their photos. You can watch Kris' parents walk the route the girls took in this youtube video for which I made English subtitles. It is a very insightful and moving video. After passing the top of the Il Pianista trail, the parents saw for themselves that there is simply one track you can follow. Kris' father says that he and his wife think there is no way you can get lost here, given that there are no exits. It leads you in about an hour walking time through a simple ongoing path from the Mirador, passing two quebrada gullies, forest and small streams, to an open stretch of meadow fields with some scattered small sheds. There are in fact two finca's located in that meadow* (*also called the Paddock often]; a finca is the equivalent of a small house in rural, agricultural countryside, often no more than a wooden basic house or even a shed in Panama. So at about an hour's walk from this first small stream after the Pianista summit (the place where photos #507 and #508 were taken), there was in theory the opportunity for Kris and Lisanne to find shelter in one of such finca's. But when rescue workers started searching the area, they weren't there. What also stands out in this video is that the girls took tourist-style photos at the top of the Pianista trail, between 13:00-13:15 PM if we go by the digital camera's time settings. And they kept taking photos as they kept following the path downhill, passing the first small water stream, around 14:00 PM, but.. then there were around two and a half more hours to go before the girls started to make their first emergency phone call attempt. In which only the missing photo 509 'may' have been taken. Where did they walk to during those next hours? 

And why do we not have any more photos of the rest of the ongoing trail? The parents say on camera that there is literally nowhere you can seriously fall on this trail, or where you can get lost. It's one trail, surrounded by mountain walls. Either you walk on, or you walk back. If you walk on, there is another water stream soon after, which is like a mini waterfall; Kris' father says on camera that he doesn't understand why the girls wouldn't have taken photos there, as it is a pretty sight. They also could have known about it beforehand because they had looked the trail up online the day prior. So why not take a photo here, like they had already done with some other pretty spots, Hans Kremers wonders out loud? And walking further, still on one clearly defined trail, the parents come up to a meadow of sorts, which would have had stunning views on April 1st 2014 when the girls were there, as it was nice cloudless weather. Yet here were no photos taken either. Kris' father finds this strange. And if the girls had thought initially that moving on from the Mirador, further down the jungle would bring them somehow back to Boquete or to civilization, then they would have known by now that this was not the case, he says. The wide views make it clear that Boquete is not in this direction. And Kris' parents think that they would definitely have turned around at that point to walk back. In January of 2015 Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot walked this same trail and confirmed that indeed, it is one ongoing trail without side trails. The Kremers family lawyer Enrique Arrocha also hiked the trail himself and went all the way to where the bones were found, which is further up north. He also doesn’t believe the trail is poorly marked (or that the girls got lost). 


Short interview with the parents from Kris: Hans Kremers and Roelie Grit, as well as Dick Steffens 

September 23rd 2014
In a special Dutch TV program about missing persons, the parents from Kris sat down on September 23rd 2014 and made some more interesting statements. To start with the introduction sentence from the presenter: "Dutch authorities say that Kris and Lisanne have been killed". Former undercover police detective Dick Steffens, from whom I have posted more interviews throughout this blog, replied with: "I think they were killed, yes." [25:20]; 

"We could have done the ping for a long time, that is, if I had been given the telephone numbers, we could have put them in a computer somewhere abroad and as soon as the telephone then makes contact with the satellite or with a cell tower, we would have received the information about where exactly their telephone was on the map. We would have then had a decent location." 

Roelie: "Do you know what I find so horrible? There were a few offers from specialists in the beginning to help ... that gentleman with the telephones for instance (= Dick Steffens) and then the thought that they might have been saved drives you insane". Hans: "And that there is no communication with us, that we were never told about this offer made by Steffens." Roelie: "We knew nothing". Hans: "And we also have no idea what the reason was for the police authorities or Foreign Affairs to reject this offer". Hans also tells that the Ministry of Foreign Affairs had started to dismiss him as a nuisance and a whiner, because he kept asking for more information or for more to be done to solve the case. Which is shocking and saddening, considering how very poorly the authorities both in the Netherlands and in Panama have both communicated ánd investigated in what I would now call a Cold Case. So many opportunities to save the girls, or at least solve this case when it was still possible in the early days have been wasted and squandered by the authorities. I'd be mad as hell if I were the parent of one of these girls, and had been put aside as a 'trouble maker' by the authorities that should be there to help. - So, I taped this short interview and put English subtitles under it, here it comes:

And in another interview, Dick Steffens treated the case of the missing women also as if crime was almost certainly part of it. But he referred only to the months old Panamanian request for assistance, which mentioned that the women had possibly been kidnapped. However, the Panamanian authorities - after finding more evidence - currently see little reason to suspect anything other than misadventure. When the interviewer asked Steffens why the Dutch police apparently didn't agree with him, he said that "as far as I know, the Dutch police have not been involved with the actual investigations there" [in Panama].

One of the last big TV interviews with the Kremers family, who still had no report or official DNA match in October 2014 

October 1st, 2014
RTL Late Night
Check out the video itself here

Presenter Humberto Tan: "It is still not clear what happened to Lisanne Froon and Kris Kremers in Panama."
Reporter: "Today is the half year mark of the disappearance of Kris and her friend Lisanne in Panama. The two have not been seen since April 1st." 
Local searcher: "We have to find these two girls as soon as possible. Because it gets so cold up there.'
Reporter: "Both families receive messages of support from the entire country."
Arjen Robben: "We hope that it helps a bit and we give our support to the family especially." 
Reporter: "At the end of June, the worst scenario becomes reality. The bone fragments that were found, turn out to be of Kris and Lisanne. Last week the bone remains and the belongings of Lisanne were finally handed over to her parents. They arrived in the Netherlands yesterday. Her parents have returned as well. But the situation is very different for the parents of Kris. They are left empty handed and with many questions. They demand a lot more effort in finding more remains of their daughter and question the effectiveness of the investigation."

"We have a lawyer in Panama who asks every other week for the report on the DNA testing of the rib. For the DNA report on the jeans shorts that was found. But it still isn't coming.. [We're talking October 1st of 2014 here]"

Humberto Tan: "Welcome Hans and Roelie. And also Dick Steffens, former police detective. You help the family. More about this later. There are many questions.. And there are so many open questions, that I hardly know where to start.But let's start with the most pressing questions yoú yourself still have. Which are they, at the moment?"
Hans Kremers: "Well, that are also a lot. Our most important question is: what has happened and what could have happened to them? And the information we have now is what is in the NFI report, which has come out. And we have been able to read it."
Humberto Tan: "From the Forensic Institute?"
Hans Kremers: "From the Forensic Institute. Unfortunately we haven't received the full report yet... But we hope that we will still receive that.. But in any case, what emerges from the part of the report that we did see, is that there are for instance data known about the mobile phones. For four days the phone was logged in with the correct PIN code[s] and that after that .. there have been attempts for four or five days to log in to the phone with the incorrect PIN code. So you would think then: hey, a 3rd person is involved here. Or at least not Kris. DNA traces have been found on the backpack and the mobile phone, from an unknown man and an unknown woman. And sand and leaf residue have been found inside the backpack. Well these are very concrete things for us, which you can research with further police investigations."
Humberto Tan: "That telephone investigation intrigues me, because we had John van den Heuvel here last season.. We discussed the fate of your daughter as well back then. And back then he already said the following about the telephone."
John van den Heuvel: "The family has requested multiple times, also on request of the police team in Panama they asked the Dutch police to provide the telephone data. Because they are of course essential. Those two mobile phones of the girls have also disappeared. So there is a good chance that they carried them with them when they went on their hike. Those phones were set to flight mode. But through Wi-Fi, which you can of course pick up when you are at a spot that has a Wi-Fi connection ..then you can still use such a phone, to whatsapp or whatever. And they did use those mobile phones those two previous weeks. And the phone history, of those previous conversations made, is very important. But it takes time and it takes more time and we're still waiting for this information." 
Humberto Tan: "Yes. April 1st the girls disappear. And the next days the phones are first activated with the correct login code. And after that many times with the incorrect login code."
Hans Kremers: "Yes."
Humberto Tan: "How long did it take for you to even receive this information?"
Hans Kremers: "Well we've asked for this for a long time. At the end of June the backpack was found, with the mobile phones inside. And then the whole thing is handed to the NFI [Dutch Forensic Institute] for inspection. We have asked about it endlessly. At the end of August even, and then we were told by the OM (Dutch  public prosecutor's office] that the NFI was still busy with it. Later we found out that the report was already finalized sooner. So why it all takes so long is one question that is on our minds. Well what you see is that.. what John van den Heuvel said, that those phones were set to flight mode... It turns out that this is not the case. From the moment the girls arrived in Panama, those phones have made contact with different cell towers. So that means that these phones were switched on. What surprised us a bit in the NFI report, is that the phone data has been printed out from April 1st onward. Or at least from what we have been able to see. But what also interests us is the SMS and whatsapp history of before April 1st; from the moment they arrived in Panama." 
Humberto Tan: "And you still haven't been given that info?"
Hans Kremers: "We still haven't seen anything about this no."
Humberto Tan: "But they can trace that information? You can see that data?"
Hans Kremers: "I assume that when you extract the data from a mobile phone, that all the information that is registered within that phone can also be extracted." 

Dick Steffens: "In the official Panamanian request for mutual assistance, the following term is very specifically mentioned: investigation within the context of DEPRIVATION OF LIBERTY. In other words: kidnapping. Two forms that were written on June 20th."

Humberto Tan: "Dick Steffens, former police detective, can you shed some light on why these type of cases take so long? Is this normal?"
Dick Steffens: "Well I don't think so. And certainly not in these type of cases. Acting fast is of course essential. I have no explanation for this."
Humberto Tan: "What could be a plausible explanation?"
Dick Steffens: "The big difference is the opinion of the Panamanian authorities, which could be clearly determined from a piece that was attached to the NFI report recently. And in which the Panamanian authorities ask for Dutch assistance through an official request for mutual assistance. So a request for help from the Dutch authorities in the forensic investigation of these mobile phones. And in this official request the following term is very specifically mentioned: investigation within the context of DEPRIVATION OF LIBERTY. In other words: involuntary deprivation of liberty is another word for kidnapping."
Humberto Tan: "A kidnapping. Yes."
Dick Steffens: "And in the Netherlands they continue to say: no, this is a case of them having gotten lost. But when you properly review the facts, and they could have done this some time ago already..."
Humberto Tan: "But just going by my own logic for a minute here, the girls went missing in Panama. The Panamanian authorities have signed a document in which they are stating that they think we are dealing with a case of kidnapping I say this in my own words now." 
Dick Steffens: "Yes. Two forms that were written on June 20th." [Scarlet: and the backpack and phones and cameras were found on June 11th]
Humberto Tan: "And in the Netherlands they say that the girls went missing. Why this difference? I mean I would think: Panama is leading, it happened in that country, I have the feeling that they have their noses closer on the whole investigation.. Why is there such a difference?"
Dick Steffens: "I have no idea. It is inexplicable. Nobody can explain it. When you look at the facts, and also at the first emergency call that was made.. It was made on April 1st at 16:39 pm. The last emergency calls, and there were four or five of such calls, not just made with Kris' phone but also with the phone of Lisanne... And then I think to myself; if this is a missing person case, then this started at April 1st. Then an emergency call was made on April 1st at 16:39 pm. Ok, then there is an accute emergency at that exact moment. But in the next days, there were also emergency calls made. And subsequently someone also tried to log in to these phones until April 8th or 9th. So these phones..."
Humberto Tan: "Up to 80 times, as I understand it."
Dick Steffens: "Yeh, something like that."
Humberto Tan: "80 attempts were made to log into these phones of these girls."
Dick Steffens: "Yeh I don't have the exact numbers at hand, but 80 times give or take."

"80 attempts were made to log into these phones of these girls."

Humberto Tan: "You went to Panama and when you were at that trail, what did you think when you realized that you can't easily get lost here?"
Roelie Grit: "No, that is very strange. During the entire walk you try to imagine what she may have thought at the time and at which points she would have had to take decisions. And it is just very strange. Well according to us you cannot get lost there."
Humberto Tan: "And now I am very sorry for bringing this up, but these are the facts as we now know them and I like to check with you if they are correct. In the summer the news broke that a rib was found. Which is said to have belonged to your daughter. Is that actually correct?"
Roelie Grit: "We still do not know that. We haven't received the report yet. The DNA report."
Other guest: "How come that is taking so long? Because DNA matching should be done much faster surely?"
Roelie Grit: "Yes. I don't know either."
Hans Kremers: "We have no idea. I mean we have a lawyer in Panama who asks every other week for the report on the DNA testing of the rib. For the DNA report on the jeans shorts that was found.  But it still isn't coming.. [We're talking October 1st of 2014 here]."
Humberto Tan: "But how... Yeh... I am trying to think here.. I mean I am trying to put myself in the shoes of the parent and I think you must go crazy. How is it possible that we are all hearing stories in the media,everywhere that yes, it is a rib of your daughter. And that you have still not received a confirmation of this??"
Hans Kremers: "Yes. Well, that is what we also find very... uh.. strange. Yeh.. at some point you get the feeling: why is it happening the way it does now? Why do we have to wait so incredibly long for the NFI report? Why do we have to wait so incredibly long for the DNA investigation? Up until the point that you start to wonder if there is a conscious effort to put the breaks on the investigation, in the hope that we drop out or something."
Humberto Tan: "With which interest?"  
Hans Kremers: "No idea."
Other guest: "What strikes me with the media, and also with that video just yet, is that it is said: the parents of Kris Kremers have still many questions. But it's not so surely that the parents of Lisanne Froon do not have such questions? Or do they have a different approach and do they not want to prod too much? Do you work together in this? Because I see those people hardly ever."
Roelie Grit: "Well we have agreed that they.. how shall I put this.. They don't want to be in the media. And we will also not say something about them. I dont think that is a good idea."
Humberto Tan: "Now is it so that this search of yours costs a lot of time, and also sadness. But also money. How do you solve that?" 
Hans Kremers: "Well we established a foundation, in April already. Together with the parents of Lisan, the Foundation Find Kris and Lisanne. And .. how shall I put it.. many people in the Netherlands have donated generously. So thanks to this foundation, we have the finances to get the things we want investigated."
Humberto Tan: "Otherwise you couldn't."
Hans Kremers: "Otherwise we would have been forced to stop a long time ago already."

"How is it possible that we are all hearing stories in the media,everywhere that yes, it is a rib of your daughter. And that you have still not received a confirmation of this??"

Humberto Tan: "How could an acceleration of it all be forced to take place? Because it is in fact torture for parents, to have to wait this long for a seemingly simple answer: is it my daughter, yes or no? There are DNA tests for this. There may even already be a test result of this. But we just don't know. How can this whole process be sped up, in your specialist opinion?"
Dick Steffens: "I think that the whole investigation simply has to be reinstated. Because there are all sorts of new facts that have emerged, afterwards new information and new traces have been found. And I think that this absolutely justifies the start of a new follow-up investigation. And my two colleagues, Juul van der Linden and Klaas Wilting and I looked at it all and we think that.. we have analyzed the case and came up with a set of questions and recommendations.. What you should do now is listen to witnesses all over again, look once more at that trail and look closely where they could have exactly disappeared. You should work with a time frame; they started to hike that trail at 11 AM, at 14:00 PM the last photo was taken .. At 16:39 PM the 1st emergency call was made. At 14:00 when the photo was taken, you see a cheerful girl being pictured. So nothing was the matter yet. And then two hours later you suddenly have an emergency phone call. What must have happened by then? It is not possible that they fell in the water at that point, that is impossible, because then their phones would not have been in working order anymore."

"Look, what we're currently dealing with is that you get the feeling that we are being seen as difficult. Whiners, troublemakers, who just don't want to give up. And who can emotionally not deal with the loss of Kris, or something. That's all bullshit.  All we want is to find answers to our questions. To at least be able to join forces with the authorities and to not have the feeling that you also have to fight with them, on top of everything else."

Humberto Tan: "And what role do the local stories that are coming from Boquete play in all this? That  in the past year alone there were apparently 51 disappearances? And are we talking here about 51 missing person's cases? Or 51 temporary disappearances? Is that known?"
Hans Kremers: "Well as far as I know, so don't pin me on this, this involves 51 missing person's cases and two of these people have been found alive, and seven have been found dead. And of the remaining 42 nothing is known."
Humberto Tan: "And... and do the Panamanian authorities have an explanation for this? Or also not? They find this normal?"
Hans Kremers: "Yeh well I don't know if they find this normal or not, but it certainly surprised us when we heard this. .. but to also find out what's behind those statistics and if there are people behind this who are actively involved in more of these disappearances." 
Humberto Tan: "That's what your feelings are about this at the moment?"
Hans Kremers: "Yeh.. that wouldn't surprise me." 
Humberto Tan: "Who should take ownership of this problem here in the Netherlands you think? Who should you address or hold accountable?"
Hans Kremers: "Well it actually doesn't matter to me who we have to address for this, as long as... Look, what we're currently dealing with is that you get the feeling that we are being seen as difficult. Troublesome."
Humberto Tan: "Whiners?" 
Hans Kremers: "That we are whiners, troublemakers, who just don't want to give up. And who can emotionally not deal with the loss of Kris, or something. That's all bullshit. All we want is to find answers to our questions, and we believe that there are concrete reasons enough to continue the investigation to find those answers. All we ask for is cooperation." 
Other guest: "But you have enough reasons to assume that more can be found there, in terms of answers. Then someone in the Netherlands should push for this, and what's more, there should be a special national subsidy for this. Because as we just said, how often does such a thing really happen in the Netherlands? That children disappear abroad and that parents have to search for them? Not very often. Politicians should back such an initiative." 
Hans Kremers: "Yeh. that would be a good thing indeed, because as I just explained, we set up that foundation and thanks to that we are in the thankful position of being able to continue to fund these searches. But there will also be many parents, who's children went missing and who did not have this opportunity. Or who could not generate this amount of attention. For some reason we did manage to create that attention. In that sense we are also very glad that we got the offer from Dick and his colleagues. Who help us analyze it all, who have also read the NFI report. And that has given us enormous support, knowing that we aren't completely crazy or stupid. And there are people who understand this business, who confirm what we are thinking. But I agree with you that it would be good if more people would be able to initiate their own searches, or to at least be able to join forces with the authorities. And to not have the feeling that you also have to fight with them, on top of everything else."

Interview with Hans and Roelie Kremers: How do you live on without hope? Article 
October 12th 2014. By Kim Bos. 

Half a year after their daughter Kris Kremers disappeared in Panama, her parents are trying to rebuild their lives. This is difficult, because they still have many questions. This afternoon, Roelie Grit may start removing the loose branches from the garden. She tells it with a half smile, as if to mock the banality of it. Her partner Hans Kremers goes to volleyball later. Roelie: "We are working to build the outer edges of our lives back up again, or so I call it, by doing normal things again." Over half a year ago, their daughter Kris Kremers (21) went with her friend Lisanne Froon (22) on a trip to Panama. On April 2, they did not return to their guest house in the village of Boquete. In late June this newspaper spoke for the first time with the Kremers family - the family Froon was there also at the time, but they are nowadays reluctant to interact with the media. The conversation involved the search efforts to find the girls, and about having to live between hope and fear. The parents tried not to think in doomsday scenarios. Roelie Grit had a mantra to expel creepy scenes from her mind. "She's alive and she will be found," she would say over and over again to herself. But a few hours after that interview in June, it was announced that "human remains" of the girls were found by the river in the area where they would go hiking. "Hope is gone ..." wrote Nikki van Passel, spokesperson for the Kremers family and closely involved in the case, in a late night text message.  Now the parents of Kris sit at the same sturdy wooden table in their living room. Next to still stands the small table with candles and pictures, which Roelie Kremers had decorated for Kris after her disappearance. When they called it 'a table of hope'. Since it has become clear that their daughter is no longer alive, it has a different name: 'Kris' little place'. How do you live on without hope? In other words, how are the parents doing now? Hans: "Sometimes the grief is really affecting you, but other times those moments are limited. We also have two sons aged 18 and 24. If Kris had been our only child, I suspect we would have sunk far deeper into our grief." Hans and Roelie do not appear defeated. Occasionally the conversation falters briefly because they have to swallow hard. They can express very eloquently how they feel. Roelie: "We try to find a balance. On the inside it is a big ravage; inside we need to give the loss a place. But we also want to remain combative. "

"DNA of a third person has been found on the backpack and on the phone. The bag contains sand and vegetation residues. Where does that come from? This is detective work, you would expect that the police starts investigating that."

Was there a crime? Hans and Roelie can not collapse because they have "a kind of mission." Did the girls get lost, or was there a crime? For the parents it is not yet clear. Roelie: "We want to do everything we can to find out what happened to her. We feel that we owe that to Kris." Last Tuesday a casket with the remains of Lisanne Froon arrived in the Netherlands. With that, the Panamanian forensic investigation of her is finished. The parents of Kris Kremers have decided, together with their lawyer, that they do not yet want to receive the remains that have been found of their daughter, so that the research continues. They also want their daughter to come home as 'complete' as possible. From Kris a pelvic bone and probably a piece of rib - Roelie and Hans have not yet seen that confirmed in black and white - have been found back so far. "Surely you can not organize a funeral if the possibility exists that a few weeks later more pieces of your child pop up?" 'Pieces'. Roelie finds it a very unpleasant word to use when talking about Kris. Usually they try to describe it differently. The parents try to allow the mundane aspects of everyday life back into their lives again, bit by bit. But the content of their conversations and the things they wonder about are often rare. How do you talk about the body of your deceased daughter? "I remember when I was writing an email to you," says Roelie against spokesperson Van Passel who also sits at the table again, "and then I thought: how do you have to call that? Which word do you use for that? It is one of the most painful things. That your child is found in pieces along the river." Hans: "You have to name it now and then, but there always remains a hesitation in it." Roelie: "It undermines her so much." At the moment there are no searches taking place for the rest of the remains of Kris and Lisanne. The research is the responsibility of the Panamanian authorities. They confirmed lately that another search effort would in fact take place. But when, where or with whom, the parents of Kris do not know. They find this uncertainty exhausting.

They fear for example, that the police in her quest for answers is relying too much on the assumption that the girls got lost, and that the possibility of a crime is barely explored.

Radiant in the last photo - Hans and Roelie have doubts about the commitment of the Panamanian and Dutch authorities. They fear for example, that the police in her quest for answers is relying too much on the assumption that the girls got lost, and that the possibility of a crime is barely explored. And why is not more done to get the whole truth out and on the table? Hans: "A report by the Dutch Forensic Institute (NFI) indicates that Kris and Lisanne took their last photo with their camera at two o'clock in the afternoon. We have seen that picture, Kris is pictured just beaming on it. But then there are many beautiful places on the route, when you keep following it. If they truly got lost then why weren't those beauty spots photographed? And if they got lost, then why did they not take any more pictures? That raises questions, doesn't it? Maybe something happened after that photo was taken at two o'clock."And on that trail you can hardly get lost, the parents of Kris, who also took the walkway itself, say. They also want the investigators to start looked at phone records from Kris Lisanne from before their disappearance. Hans: "Who knows, they may have had contact with someone, perhaps there is more important information." But there is no mention of it in the NFI report, according to Hans and Roelie. There are many more questions that the parents want answered - but which can often can't be answered. 

Hans: "It's almost like the authorities have the attitude of: you just listen, good citizen; we are the police and we do the investigation, and no-one else has anything to do with this. Once we come to a conclusion, we'll let you know."

During the conversation Roelie and Hans occasionally get mad - in a controlled manner, they raise their voices a bit at most. They just spoke about the hassle regarding the NFI report, which only arrived at the prosecution in Panama a month after the study was completed. Hans: "First they received a Dutch version. And later a translated, brief summary of six pages. "A spokesman for the prosecution in the Netherlands let them know they "did not find this slow at all". Panama could request an extensive version of the report if they wanted to, the Dutch prosecution said. Hans: "The authorities don't make any effort to find out more answers, while we think that there are specific things where they can still work on. DNA of a third person has been found on the backpack and on the phone. The bag contains sand and vegetation residues. Where does that come from? This is detective work, you would expect that the police starts investigating that." Roelie: "In the first place in Panama, because officially the country where the disappearance took place takes the responsibility for this investigation, but when you can conclude that they do not do this investigation, then you expect as Dutch citizens that your own authorities make themselves hard for this and do this job. But it just doesn't happen." The Dutch police travelled during the beginning of the searches twice to Boquete to assist. After that, you are on your own.

There are many beautiful places on the route, when you keep following it. If they truly got lost then why weren't those beauty spots photographed? 

You are on your own - Roelies view on humanity has not changed since the disappearance of their daughter, she says. She still has a positive outlook on life. But her trust in the authorities has changed. "We are brought up in the Netherlands with the idea that you can trust the authorities, that they stand up for their citizens. That idea was rooted very deeply with me. Now I no longer believe in it. That is very unpleasant." Nikki van Passel: "For me this is also one of the conclusions after this disappearance. If you are abroad and something happens, who will you help? People need to realize that they may be left alone to face the music then." Van Passel also represents the families of other people who disappeared abroad, like Mary-Anne Goossens and Ingrid Visser and Louis Severein. "If you are abroad and something happens, you're on your own. Nobody realizes that." Hans and Roelie have received a lot of help from Panamanian institutions especially, they say. In the first two weeks after the girls went missing, people searched very hard. In December, when the river reduces in water size and drops a few meters, another last search attempt is planned. Hans: "Whether the authorities want to help or not." The family has enough Panamanian contacts that they can enable. In April Hans and Roelie hired a Panamanian private detective who was involved for a few months. And there are local tour guides who like to go out looking for the parents. The costs can be covered by money collected by Answers for Kris, the foundation that the parents founded." The past few weeks I have longed sometimes to not have to occupy myself with Panama for a bit. I want to focus on Kris and process her loss. Roelie: "We think sometimes about what we want her funeral to be like. That may sound weird, but we at least have the luxury to think about this for a bit longer. Normally you must arrange all that very quickly."

The case of Kris and Lisanne
March 15, 2014. Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon leave for Panama. They follow two weeks a language course and then volunteer.
2nd April. The girls have not been in their house all night. The woman of the family where Kris and Lisanne stay, call the parents of Lisanne.
June 11th. Along the river Culubre finds a local resident a backpack with stuff from Kris and Lisanne. Starting today combing a search team of guides and residents at the request of the family from the area.
June 19th. Panamanian media report that 'human remains' are found: bones and two left shoes. The residues analyzed in the next days and it is established that it is Kris and Lisanne. Fixed
July 31st. The parents of Kris in Panama. Find Indians along the river six pieces of bone. In the first instance, it can not be said to be of Kris or Lisanne - it would be of animals or people of a different age. But about two weeks later still shows a DNA test that a piece of rib Kris is covered.
1st October. The remains of Lisanne Froon found in Panama, arrive in the Netherlands. Remains of Kris Kremers remain at the express request of the family in Panama because the case is otherwise closed.

Pauw interview of November 21st of 2014

Pauw, November 21st, 2014
Jeroen Pauw:
 "I have never been there [in Panama]. Have you ever been there? 
Peter R. de Vries: "No."
Jeroen Pauw: "You have."
Martijn Froon: "Yes". 
Jeroen Pauw: "Everybody says: you almost cannot get lost there." 
Martijn Froon: "Well yeh that is what we have experienced ourselves also. On the north side.. no on the south side on the trail facing the village [of Boquete] it is nearly impossible. It is one straight forward path. Only going up. It is a difficult hike because you have to climb quite a few meters. And when you leave the trail you can go quite a few meters down also, there are steep slopes where a lot of things could happen. Like I said; on the south side the trail is not that difficult but once you reach the summit and go over to the north side, then the trail changes completely." 
Jeroen Pauw: "And what do you think is the most likely thing that has happened then?"
Martijn Froon: "Well, what our conclusion is... here you see a photo of the other side of the trail. It is one big blubbering mudfest. The walls are reaching up. I really struggled to walk there [Scarlet; but when Kris and Lisanne walked there the conditions were dry...] As you can see here, I sometimes couldn't even pass through upright and had to bend. They walked this trail for almost an hour. So then you reach the spot where the last photo was taken around 2 PM, 2.30 PM[Scarlet: camera data says they were there at 2 PM and it was less than an hour's walk] And then you know that you need to walk back for at least 4 more hours, the same route, until you are back in Boquete." [I'm sorry, I don't understand his calculations.. It took the girls 2 hours to reach the summit and less than 1 hour to reach the stream of photo 508.. Going back would have taken them significantly less time than those 3 hours, as they would be going downhill for the most part.]
Martijn Froon: "And then they would have returned past this same trail, and I know my sister a little bit and she would not have liked that. So then they would have reached the point at 2:30 PM where they wondered; what should we do? Either we turn around and walk back. Knowing for sure that it is 4 more hours of walking [Scarlet; wrong calculations imo]. Or we keep walking, in the hope of reaching something. 
Peter R. de Vries: "Well I don't think you can say... that is in my opinion the most basic error they have made..
Jeroen Pauw: "Who are 'they'?"
Peter R. de Vries: "Well, the media. The people who have spoken out about this. Saying that you cannot get lost there. But that is something, then you are arguing from a certain logic, which is especially in these type of circumstances not applicable. I have climbed mountains myself, and so I know a little bit about what it does to you when you have a shortage of water or food. How quickly you weaken then. And also what it does to your mental state when you sprain an ankle, for instance. And when you think: how can I go down as soon as possible. It is easy to say then that the route is straight forward and that you cannot get lost on it. But the moment you want to go down as soon as possible and when a certain panic washes over you, you will start looking for shortcuts. And then you go off the beaten track and off-trail. And so you can think of all sorts of scenarios which in my opinion have not been taken enough into account." [Scarlet: Peter has never been in Boquete, he never walked the trail for himself and he has no idea what options there really are to look for a shortcut. Everybody has spoken of and shown footage of one clearly defined trail. With no side trails to even choose from. Is he seriously considering that Kris and Lisanne would weed through foliage and down slopes, with a potential sprained ankle, to find a shortcut? In that completely unknown and new place in Panama? I find this very, very far-fetched and hypothetical. These two men are basically dissing the Kremers' findings.] 
Jeroen Pauw: "And that is also the scenario which you both..."
Martijn Froon: "That is one of the conclusions which we have come to. At 4:20 PM that same afternoon, the first emergency call attempt was made [Scarlet: Official info says this was at 4:39 PMThere is an hour and a half in between. I find it plausible that something happened in the meantime. Uhm, maybe that one of the girls fell, or that something happened. Or that they at least knew that they wouldn't make it back out of the forest before sunset. And if we don't do something now, we will have to spend the night here."
Jeroen Pauw:
 "Yes. That is what they have most likely also done, in your story. They have made it through the night. They weren't really dressed for that, I don't believe they brought a lot of things with them."
Martijn Froon: 
"A tank top and shorts. No food and one small water bottle*." [*Kris is pictured with two water bottles in photo #491]
Jeroen Pauw:
 "No food, little water. No protective clothing. The day after it started to rain heavily in the area, I believe."
Martijn Froon: 
Jeroen Pauw:
 "That will leave you a little more cold also." 
Martijn Froon: 
"Well.. not a little bit. You are getting soaking wet and then you won't be able to get warm again." 
Peter R. de Vries: 
"You weaken very rapidly."
Jeroen Pauw:
 "So within this story as you are telling it now... backed by Peter.. what do you think happened on day 2, 3, or 4 or 5?" 
Martijn Froon: 
"Well that... we will never know that. That will always remain an open question. You know, did one of those girls fall in a ravine? Did they get into an argument about what they would do. Did they both go their separate way? You won't get answers to those questions." 
Jeroen Pauw:
 "There are a few things.. You wonder; did they get lost or not? Let's assume, based on your story and from what Peter says, that they did, presumably. Because something happened. A sprained ankle perhaps, maybe we can find a shortcut. Maybe if we turn left here we can get down just a bit faster. At some point you are lost. Those phones have been logged into, right? Several times. How often were emergency services called?"
Martijn Froon: 
"About 15 or 20 times, off the top of my head."
Jeroen Pauw:
 "Were text messages or other messages found in these phones, which gave any indication what happened?"
Martijn Froon: 
"No. No, no form of what sort of message at all. Those phone were switched on. The first six days the phone was systematically switched on and off about three times a day. And that suggests that they were clever about the state of the battery. It was an iPhone and everybody knows how quickly the battery is dead from those type of devices. [Scarlet; only this iPhone from Kris was powered on for 11 days, with a start on day 1 of only 50% battery..] Turning the phone on, making a call, switching the phone off again. Waiting for a better moment." 
Peter R. de Vries: "That's the point, of course. Because you have no cellphone reception, there are of course also no text messages made." [Scarlet: Yeh let's all forget about the option of making unsent draft messages for loved ones]
Jeroen Pauw: "Well.. you know yourself that you sometimes start typing a text message, and then it would have been still in the phone, without having been sent.." 
Peter R. de Vries: "Well, when you see that there is no cell reception, you do not even start typing a text message, I think. But the fact that those phones were logged in over a longer period of time, and those emergency numbers were called is for me an indication that the chance of them being a victim of a crime is smaller. Because it is hard to imagine that if these two girls had been in the power of someone else, who had kidnapped them or who held them captive, that they had been able to use their phones still for several days." 
Jeroen Pauw: "But then in the end, it is also the case that these phones were not entered correctly anymore. Or that no more login codes were entered correctly. This also led to thoughts with others that perhaps another person tried to work with these phones."
Martijn Froon: "Yeh.. well everybody who has a mobile phone and a screen lock; I ask you, how often does a login go wrong every day? That you accidentally press in the wrong number combination, or something. And the iPhone required both a screen lock and a PIN code. The first days they were entered both correctly, but later... And like Peter says: when you haven't eaten for six days..."
Peter R. de Vries: "You become disoriented."
Martijn Froon: "You no longer know what you are doing. [Scarlet: Except for 90-something sharp and focused night photos, of course, on day 8] And then you literally and figuratively are tripping'. And then I can understand completely that you are no longer capable of entering the right PIN code 
Jeroen Pauw: "One more time, I'm sorry for bringing these things up but you are no doubt used to this. Back to the photo camera. We just saw photos [of Lisanne on the summit]. You say, these are the last photos. But there were more photos on the camera, right? Later photos. Vague photos. This.. Is this such a photo?" 
Martijn Froon: "Yes." 
Jeroen Pauw: "I have of course no idea what we are exactly looking at here.. You neither I think?"Martijn Froon: "No, well we have of course thought a lot about these photos and have been staring at them for many an hour. What could be going on here? Police have also looked into this photo. And they have used all sorts of photo editing programs to lighten things up, to find out if anything of importance could be seen here. But the majority of them... and that is the theory that came out of this, that they have tried to use the flash to light up the overhanging foliage, to try to signal overcoming air traffic, or something." 
Jeroen Pauw: "Yes, so the flash as an emergency signal."
Martijn Froon: "Yes. Or maybe that they heard something. And wanted to look what was out there." 
Jeroen Pauw: "Is there also an explanation, and I ask this the both of you, for the last part of this story? 
That the human remains of the both of them have been found a great distance away and that so little was left of them?"
Peter R. de Vries: "Well for me.. I already spoke with him about this before the show. It does not surprise me at all. I have been involved in numerous cases in which the same thing happened. Those processes go incredibly fast in the jungle. It is warm there, it is humid, there are animal who do certain things. [Scarlet; this was an elevated cloud forest, the bones of both girls were found in wildly different stages of decomposition and there were no clear signs of animal predation found on the bones....] I recently read a book about the FARC in Colombia, who kept prisoners in the jungle there at times, who sometimes died. And the fellow prisoners would go on to describe that the bodily remains would be completely gone and decomposed in 4 or 5 days. [Scarlet; this was not the case at all for Lisanne's remains, 10 weeks and even 5 months later though; why not give a possible explanation for this?] So it does not surprise me at all. It may even be called exceptional that something was found at all. [And how about the skulls, Peter?]
Martijn Froon: "Yeh, I also think, all the people who ask; why wasn't more found? I think you have to reverse the question: that we should be happy that something was found of them at all. 
And the remains that were found were complete lucky shots from locals who live there. 
And they weren't found by official police searchers. So we have to count our lucky stars that we found anything at all. Otherwise we would have never known anything. 
Peter R. de Vries: "One thing I do like to add; what is perhaps remarkable, is that I did have the expectation and the hope perhaps that.. that the girls at any moment would have realized or thought; this is getting precarious. And despite not having cellphone reception, that they would nevertheless have been capable to make a video of each other. On their phone perhaps. Or to leave an (audio) message of sorts. Yeh...."
Martijn Froon: "Would you want to do that? I mean, they have searched the area with helicopters. I am certain that they were in that area and that they came very close during the search. And I know almost certainly that they have heard the helicopters in the distance. And then the question is: would you really turn that camera around and would you really make a video of that, saying, this will probably be our last images?"
Peter R. de Vries: "You are of course also always optimistic. Thinking it will all be alright in the end. 
But well, that... hmm." 
Jeroen Pauw: "It seems to me.."
Martijn Froon: "You have to be strong for that you know, to record such a video." 
Jeroen Pauw: "But if they lost hope at some point.. It is.. it is of course a terribly sad ending. Do you have some degree of peace about it ending in this manner? And that there wasn't a big, violent sinister incident that preceded it?" 
Martijn Froon: "Well if there is anything positive that I can take from this whole story, it is that they died a natural death. I do not want to think about a scenario where they ended up in the prostitution, or in the hands of human traffickers or something." 
Jeroen Pauw: "The family of the friend of your sister [the Kremers] think differently about this, right? 
They have not yet accepted that this is the full story." 
Martijn Froon: "No. No they indeed handle things differently. Well, that is one of the reasons why we have decided to both go our separate ways." 
Jeroen Pauw: "And now it is done?"
Martijn Froon: "And now it's hopefully done."
Jeroen Pauw: "Good. Thank you for telling your story."

Scarlet: My feeling is that this is a good interview, by one of our finest interviewers. It's all subjective, but I sensed some doubt with Jeroen Pauw, when Martijn and Peter detailed their theories. I feel that Pauw has been treading carefully, because he could sense that Martijn and the Froon family get a lot of peace of mind from their theory of events. But that he himself is not so sure about it all. He calls it repeatedly Martijn's 'story'. And highlights that the Kremers family do not believe his story. The interviewer seems to find it also peculiar that none of the girls left a goodbye message or even a draft message. Or that there were so many wrong login attempts. The peculiar state in which the backpack was found wasn't discussed for instance, and neither the early state of decomposition in which Lisanne's foot and ball of skin were found, compared to the much more decomposed bones of Kris. As for Peter R. de Vries; he has done very good investigational research in the past. One case in which he shined for instance, is the trapping of Joran van der Sloot in the Natalee Holloway case. But I have the feeling here that he isn't just talking along with Martijn Froon to please or coddle him. But that Peter truly believes by now it was a tragic accident. I am underwhelmed personally by his argumentation and broad assumptions. But opinions will differ on this. 

In local gossip magazine Privé (Private) a serious interview was published recently with the parents from Kris Kremers

April 2019
Translated by me in English. 

"Five years ago the students Kris Kremers (21) and Lisanne Froon (22) from Amersfoort disappeared in Panama during a walk in the jungle. A month and a half later only a handful of bones were found from them. Until today there are doubts about what exactly happened. "Back then só many mistakes have been made during the investigation", says father Hans Kremers.  
There is not a moment that Hans Kremers and his partner Roelie Grift don't think about their daughter Kris. At the age of 21 she disappeared together with her friend Lisanne Froon in Panama. "It is now five years since, but it feels like yesterday", says father Hans. "Kris is in our hearts. Every day again we think about her. The grief will never stop." Contact with the Froon family has stopped years ago already. For a long time the two families were united, until deep underlying tensions arose, according to Hans. Tensions about the investigation into the mysterious disappearance, about the later findings of remains of their daughters and the way in which they communicated at the time with the media. "Last year we visited Panama, in memory of our daughter. We followed the same route that the girls had taken. It was very emotional to visit the exact same spots where Kris spent the last hours of her life." The Kremers family has decided not to organize a special memorial service on June 9th, the date when their daughter's remains were found, five years ago. "We don't need that." It is almost unimaginable for him nowadays that photos of Kris and Lisanne appeared nearly daily in newspapers, TV-specials and on the news back in 2014. Day in day out their mysterious disappearance and the following search efforts were reported on.

Photo camera 
Kris and Lisanne disappeared on April 1st during a work-holiday in Panama. They stayed there to do volunteer work and to follow a Spanish language course. When they didn't return to their host family in the evening from a walk in the area of Boquete, the hostess was initially not worried about this. She thought that the two were most likely enjoying themselves in the nightlife of Boquete. But when Kris and Lisanne hadn't returned either the next day and missed an appointment with a local tour guide the next morning, they alarmed the police. Shortly after, the families of the two students travelled to Panama to help the local authorities with the search. Soon it became clear that Kris and Lisanne had walked the Il Pianista trail that morning of April 1st, a trail that passes the jungle and that lasts about three hours. The route is known to be safe, but tourists have also known to have gotten lost on it. That's why it is recommended to never walk it without a guide. For the parents a nightmare started, that would last for many weeks. A month and a half later, on June 11th, a backpack was found, containing possessions of the two young women, including a photo camera and telephone. Five days later the Panamanian guide F., who had volunteered to help searching, found several bone remnants of the women. The two appeared to have died under mysterious circumstances during their walk. Only a couple of bones were found in the nature area. The finding spot was at least eight walking hours away from the spot where Kris and Lisanne were last seen on April 1st 2014. The discovery of these bones led to many speculations at the time. Some spoke of an accident, others of kidnapping and a robbery-homicide. The Panamanian guide who found the bones on June 19th that year, explained at the time that the bones were found in the vicinity of a dangerous cable bridge over a river. Of Kris only a part of a pelvis and a rib bone was ever found. Btw: The jeans shorts were found on an estimated 14 hours of walking distance (based on a fast paced local) from the backpack, so a fair distance away. And the bone remnants were found several walking hours away again as well, further up north. 

"Back then só many mistakes have been made during the investigation", says father Hans Kremers. Until this day he has doubts about the investigation of the Panamanian authorities. Time and time again he and his relatives were confronted with inconsistencies.

Until this day Hans Kremers has doubts about the investigation of the Panamanian authorities. Time and time again he and his relatives were confronted with inconsistencies. It was investigating judge Betzaida Pitti who at the time claimed that the two students had perished during their walk, but at the same time she stated that the investigation had not been closed. "There were many loose ends. In my opinion, and that of many others, many mistakes have been made." It started already with the search operation and the inset of the Panamanian authorities. They did not go smoothly. It was so messy in fact, that both families set up their own private search operations. "I can still get very mad about it, but what's the point." Hans still wonders if the students truly got lost and died in the jungle of Boquete. "We still have doubts about things like their digital camera and their mobile phones, with which they tried to call after their disappearance. After they disappeared photos have been taken with the digital camera. We were not allowed to mention even a word about this from the Panamanian authorities at the time." Kris' father still struggles with the wobbly communication between the Dutch and the Panamanian authorities. The only tangible evidence were the bone remains of the two friends. How they exactly died, has never been established definitively. "When the case of Anne Faber was playing out I have thought for a while about writing a book. I can write an encyclopedia full by now when it comes to errors that are made during the investigation. There's no point in talking in hindsight. We have to live with the fact that our daughter is no longer here." Hans thinks it is pointless to start a new investigation, five years after the fact. "We picked life back up and will think about our dear daughter every day, no matter what Nobody can take that feeling away from us."

Break Free, the full program and I added English subtitles
In order to be able to upload the series (in parts) with English subtitles on here, the video had to be small enough in size, as blogger does not support video uploads that are bigger than 100 MB. Hence, one 40-ish minute TV program has been cut into 8 separate parts on here. Unfortunately I had to cut down on the video quality there too due to limited (free) size options. Click on the white 'play' triangle twice for the vidoeo to start. I also uploaded the entire program on my vimeo account, in two parts.





A search team member, a woman, later declared to Lisanne's father (shown in the Dutch TV program 'Break Free') that at this day, some of her dogs acted dubiously in the jungle; she wasn't sure if they had caught sense of something or not, and decided to move on. Later she regretted this and stated that she thinks they may have passed the girls unknowingly at that moment, and that they were still alive back then (also based on the camera and phone data found later). And that she regrets till this day that she didn't double check. However, Kris' brother reported to the press soon after the TV program aired, that this was nonsense, as the woman's search operation was taking place weeks after the girls went missing, at a time when they were most certainly long deceased.

You can find all the videos about this case which I uploaded and translated on my youtube channel

Telemetro's video report on the disappearance of Kris and Lisanne, translated in English

Aired on youtube on January 7th 2015. I translated a Panamanian report on the case from Spanish into English for you and added subtitles to the video. I do not speak Spanish, but there is a way to reliably convert the audio into text, and translate it like that. Apologies if small errors slipped in. I add the translated video here and will write out the translation text below also. 

Presenter: "It was between March 31 and April 1, when Boquete, little by little, learned about the news. Two young Dutch tourists, Lisanne Froon and Kris Kremers, had been declared missing two days before we went up the tourist trail of El Pianista. Everything pointed to the fact that they were lost in a closed forest in the Pila International Park, thousands of hectares between the rescuers and the European ones by land and air. Sinaprocs' own volunteers in the area tried to cover all the possibilities. It was a mobilization that was never before seen in Boquete's history, but so far the mountain has swallowed some clues about the girls' disappearance. Boquete is known worldwide for its climate, its wooded and mountainous areas, but above all for its people and safety. Coming here is for many foreigners a beautiful achievement in their lives. In fact, some 60,000 people a year come to Boquete's national parks, but especially foreigners. Some of these last foreign adventurers, sometimes in that quest for adventure, break the rules and may face danger." Local: "Including women, single ladies, and girls aged 22 to 26"

Presenter: "Lisanne and Kris did not go straight to Boquete, but first spent time in Bocas del Toro, where they made all kinds of friendships in their adventurous quest. There was a desire to volunteer, helping Indigenous children in the area. Tobias: "Where they disappeared, they didn't have a guide, no." Other guy: "They didn't have a guide?" Tobias: "But neither did they have plans to - mumble mumble - go (there?) with a guide." (I struggled with the translation of these three sentences, but KaT came to the rescue, thank you so much! Scarlet). Tobias is a Dutchman who runs the Spanish school where the two young women interacted. He says that many like them want to venture out alone, without guides. "The reason: it costs a lot. Of course."

Presenter: "It is six o'clock in the morning and I am here in Boquete, right on the path that leads to the Pianista Trail. A mountainous area. Here's where the women were last seen, at least by the taxi driver. I go with a guide, Mr. Ezequiel Miranda, who has years of experience in the area. He is a guide and also a conservationist. And with him we are going up the same route that the young women apparently took before they disappeared from the sight of everyone in the area. But instead of the morning, these two young women of 22 and 21 years of age walked the trail in the afternoon. A five-hour round trip was waiting for them. Most likely they would be caught in the evening. 

Dozens of tourists come up here every day, so it didn't attract much attention from Mrs Oliva, who lives nearby. I only saw them for a few seconds. She adds that they were quiet. "Then I was struck by the short pants they wore and the amount of bare legs. They will get sunburn that way without skin protection, I thought. And I thought about how they were going to get scratches on their legs once they got up." Presenter: "In total, about four residents, plus the taxi driver who drove them to the spot, saw the women for the last time. From here onwards, rumours arise. One of them is that they might have been intercepted by strangers."

Resident: "They are not here. They have them. They were moved elsewhere. Let's hope so, right? God willing. But this case is so difficult. If they had been on the mountain, we would have found them by now". Presenter: "There are at least two testimonies, among these that of the taxi driver, who points out that some time after the climb, these girls saw an off-road vehicle arrive in the area. The road narrows and we haven't even climbed the mountain range yet and there is no sign of any kind. There is a lack of warning or attention, or at least something to guide the person who is climbing, whether he is a national or a foreigner. Where are you? How many kilometres have you travelled? How much farther do you have to go? And the most important thing: where do you have to go? For several days, the possibility that the young women met foul play was gaining strength in the face of the fruitless searches in the forest area. However, getting lost here included the possibility of falling up to 50 metres or taking routes that could take you to the province of Bocas del Toro in the area. Mr. Ezequiel Miranda: "You will always go down, down and there. And there are several similar very steep rock faces and cliffs, many similar or much, much larger than this one." Our guide is sure that walking at night is almost fatal, but a third clue points to possible assault on these tourists. And that would not be the first time.

In fact, they assure me that a few months ago a married couple was attacked when they were making this same journey. Local living on the trail: "Know that the police have assaulted foreigners. Yes, yes". How did they assault them? Explain to me. "Well, they say hooded". 

Another local: "The situation is emerging that Indigenous people who live in the area observe the tourists when they arrive. When they leave the area they assault them, often with a knife and they take away everything of value these tourists carry on them."

Presenter: "[Two hours into the climb] There is a fork here, there are two different points, two different trails, and I myself at least brought my guide along here and he can inform me of where I am supposed to be going. But these young people who unfortunately went up without a guide, could easily get lost."

[This seems the voice over from guide F. but it is more likely Ezequiel Miranda] "You can walk in all sorts of directions, believing you are able to walk in there. The paths take you to the central mountain range, which is the highest point on this trail. And when you get there, if you lose track because you don't have the experience of walking in the mountains, you can walk towards Bocas del Toro thinking that you are going to Boquete."

Woman talking over the radio: "Law enforcement officials are requesting that if you have more knowledge of what happened during the past month to share it, because there is little concrete data."

Presenter: "Because there is little concrete data, the Complex Case Analysis Unit of the Public Prosecutor's Office intervened. Many people fear that the disappearance of these two young women goes far beyond them getting lost deep in the forests. The families of each of the young women expressed their gratitude for Panama's support during a press conference, while increasing the reward from 30,000 to 40,000 dollars.

Representative of the girls' families: "Maybe there are some new news signs, of which we do not know if they are positive or negative. We don't know what." Presenter: "There are reports based on the arguments issued by different sources. It reflects the four main possibilities of what could have happened to these girls. An attack by attackers in the forest area, who have left the country without warning now or who disappeared in the thousands of hectares of forest. [In the background you can read: *Abduction in the wooded area; *Attacked by assailants; *Departure without notice from the country; *Lost in the forest.]

A local: "People comment that it is extremely rare that these type of girls have disappeared in this way, without leaving any trace. If they did get lost, we would have found at least some traces. For instance, some piece of clothing on a fence they passed can sometimes be found." 

I have noticed that since their disappearance, the Boquete forces have been rethinking the issue of security, even though Boquetes criminal level is one of the lowest in Central America. They know that they cannot turn their backs on the current reality. Interestingly, when a young foreign woman is asked what level of security she uses when she arrives in Boquete, this is her answer: "Nothing". "Nothing?" "No"

The family of Lisanne and Kris clings to any data or rumour, like never before. They have faith that everything will end soon. Mother Lisanne: "We call for people to please, please share it if you know something."

Sometimes a mother's distress does not require any translation. Only Lisanne Froon and Kris Kremer know. It is the faith of despair. Two families who saw how that which began as their daughters' adventure, turned into their worst nightmares. 
On camera: Hiceki Santamaria.
Reporter for Telemetro Reporta: Ángel Sierra Ayarza

Another Telemetro video report: La ruta de las holandesas, su última caminata - translated in English

"The route of the Dutch, their last walk". Aired on youtube on August 8th 2014. I translated it from Spanish into English for you and added subtitles to the video. I do not speak Spanish, but there is a way to reliably convert the audio into text, and translate it like that. Apologies if small errors slipped in. I add the translated  video here and will write out the translation text below also. So this video is a reconstruction of the route the girls may have taken. I wrote in the past that the presenters of the Travel Channel were among the first ones to show us how (long) you have to walk from the Pianista summit to the first river crossing, but this presenter does it too (and already in 2014), accompanied by local guide Laureano. Although the presenter does a good job and tries to really examine which tragic route the girls most likely took, and to experience what Kris and Lisanne would have been through if they had kept walking on and on, this video differs from the one I translated yesterday, the video in the topic above this one. That presenter leaned towards foul play. This one hardly wastes a word on a foul play scenario, and neither do the locals and the guide who are interviewed. They all believe that Kris and Lisanne made it to the cable bridges of the 2nd river crossing and that they both perished here. The current then washed away their belongings and remains. Interesting comment I heard from Laureano and the presenter, as they made their way to the Mirador: Two hours later we reached the mountain range. This is the only place where there is a mobile phone signal.  Does this mean that under the summit, on the Boquete side of the mountain, there may also be no cellphone reception? Not on cloudy and foggy days at least? We still have the small mystery of Kris' parents declaring that Kris' boyfriend Stephan had last contact with Kris by phone at 14:00 on Tuesday April 1st. When they were far beyond the summit according to the camera times, in a zone of which everybody seems to agree that it has no cellphone reception.

In this video reportage, there are some subtle magical realism terms added here and there, which could have come from writers like Isabel Allende or Gabriel Garcia Marquez perhaps, about the mountain and the jungle being very beautiful but also luring you in, far away from civilization. As if these forces of nature have a will of their own and are containing dark energy. Anyway, that's more the personal feeling I got from watching and translating this video. It is more material of interest in this case. Even though I believe that just because this terrain and these circumstances allow for tourists to get lost (and they do at times), this does not mean that they can stay lost there and stay hidden with half the province out looking for them. This presenter was one day late and already Sinaproc were out to pick them up. With the help of a GPS device they gave the presenter and the tour guide before embarking on their hike, but still. The search area to cover wasn't massive (when you compare it to an area like the Darién Gap). There is also a lot of weight given to the findings of some of the clothing of Kris along this route and the bag and shoes and foot. But findings those remnants along this route deep into nature also does not mean that the girls were out there alone, or even that they themselves left them there at all. Neither was it explained by the presenter or the guide how both or even one of the girls could have stayed alive for at least 11 days, if the location of their demise was a day's walk up north, to the 2nd river crossing. The iPhone from Kris was still used by day 11. So what did they do in the 10 days in between? This river crossing was searched at the time and is passed daily, yet nobody found them here. Anyway, here we go: 

Presenter: "Because doubt still persists about which route the missing Dutch women took in Boquete, Jaime Saldaña went into the mountain that divides Chiriquí from Bocas del Toro to try and find out what could have happened to these young women."

Betzaida Pitti: "One of the findings belongs to the young women".

Presenter: "It's six o'clock in the morning and we're starting to climb the Pianista trail at the break of dawn. And here is Laureano, who apart from living in the sector is also going to serve as a guide. We are carrying the provisions and also a GPS apparatus that SINAPROC provided us with. Lisanne Froon and Kris Kremers entered this trail at 4 o'clock in the afternoon. [Scarlet; this was apparently still assumed back in early August 2014]. According to witnesses, it is a wooded, forested area with a cool atmosphere that makes you fall in love with your surroundings. After 20 minutes walking, there are already different trails. Are we on the right one? Where are they leading to?"

Laureano: "The path of the Pianist (Pianista Trail) is heading towards the mountain range".

Presenter: "So whoever follows this route has to take this way?" 

Laureano: "To the right-hand then another path, where they have to pass a fork in the road" [? I don't understand what is said then, something about the mountain payback according to the translation device] 

Presenter: "And if someone doesn't know where to go and takes this wrong route here?" 

Laureano: "They may be lost at once."
 "You don't have to walk far to find the first stream. You cross about five such creeks before and after the summit of the mountain range. Some even have a little current and others dangerous ones. At this one we found a shirt and underwear in the nearby bushes. The guide says that they could have been from Indigenous people who pass through the place often. Two hours later we reached the mountain range. This is the only place where there is a mobile phone signal. 
Then there is the viewpoint, the Mirador. After a little more than two hours of travelling, we arrive at this point which divides the province of Chiriqui with the province of Bocas del Toro. This is the main point of the route; the point where any tourist wants to arrive at to observe the two oceans in both distances, the Atlantic and the Pacific. The fog does not allow to see this now, but if a tourist arrives it is almost obligatory to get to this point and from here to return to the Boquete sector. The experts say that the foreigners decided to follow the trail from here. That whole walk is downhill and when the girls went here, it was already getting dark along the way. [Scarlet: they still believed the old timeline then].
Presenter: "What could have happened to them at this point where we are going down?"
Laureano: "I think that they were deceived at the top of the mountain range. They continued on the same trail, thinking it would lead them back to Boquete. But instead, they were walking away, towards Bocas del Toro."
Presenter: "And at night it is impossible. You see much less."
Laureano: "You see much less and everything is mountain. The only thing you see here is the path."
Presenter: "After five hours of walking, exhaustion is inevitable. On the route there is a lot of water, but nothing to eat. The trail becomes narrow, almost impassable, until you reach the first arm of the river Culebra." 
Laureano: "Hold on to the waves. Lean on the stick".
Presenter: "After that hour, we obviously got caught in the rain here and we wondered if the Dutch girls passed by here, how they managed to cross the river. 
Laureano: "We conclude that they did pass by here, but we keep in mind that at the time, in early April, there was not as much current here and there was a tablet of that stone in the river which they could step on. One could still pass through here safely and without any problem, therefore."

Presenter: "The rain was brief. We continue among pastures where we see a destroyed NÁM hut. The young women were able to take shelter. However, the people of the area believe that that night, with the darkness and fog, they may not have seen the hut. They continued to walk to the second arm of the river. This tributary always has a current. The hypothesis of the people living in this area is that the girls could have entered through here, this way." 
Laureano: "Yes." 
Presenter: "And what could they have passed?"
Laureano: "They didn't dare go over the cable wire. Maybe they looked for the trail. They have had to go down to the river to drink water and try to cross the river. [The rest is] History."

Presenter: "And that's because down this river, down the river, is where they found the bones and so on." 
Laureano: "Yes they did. From here to the villages. Over there."
Presenter: "For those who know the place. This was the final destination of the Dutch. We were going all the way to the Alto Culebra. Two more rivers have to be crossed on these cables. We reached our destination 12 hours after we entered the trail. Ángel was the one who made most of the discoveries, who did most of the findings. But he revealed something to us that the Prosecutor's Office has not said. Clothes were also found, according to him. Clothes from Kris Kremers." 
Ángel: "Yes, I found the clothes." 
Presenter: "What kind of clothes were they?"
Ángel: "They had a light colour. [Inaudible for me, sorry.. seems like he says 'No glaring']. We found that [the clothes] that day already, arriving at the second cable up there." 

Presenter: "On the way back, he showed us the place where they found the remains [the clothes], below the Culebra River crossing. All the findings were made at a spot before other rivers and streams join, to continue towards Sanguinolenta.
Ángel: "In front of the Alto Romero community they found a bag and it had not previously been there. Not even the presence of authority has been seen here. So we proceeded to cooperate, to search, to see if we could find things that belonged to them. We could find more and then there was the surprise in others who found the pink [Scarlet; the foot?] and the shoes. That is what we found."

 "On the third day we returned, it was dark and we hadn't reached the halfway point. We had to take refuge in a small-scale ranch. It is now already the third day of the trip and the intention was to leave for Boquete, but the first cramps and pains in the legs have started. This didn't allow it [to move on]. The rain didn't either. But we were able to take refuge in this ranch, something that would be difficult for a person who does not know this, because this ranch is off the path or the trail that goes from the planet to the Alto Culebra sector, where we were located. In the morning we came across a team of SINAPROC. We had by now built up a delay of a whole day from what we had planned.  At this point we had no more provisions."
SINAPROC member: "We already ran into people and took them with us at about half an hour from the Pianista's viewpoint. Let's see, they are keeping up well. They are getting food. I was about to go down."
Presenter: "We were prepared and still we had problems. Maybe Kris and Lisanne just thought they'd enjoy the trail for a while, but let themselves be carried away by its charms. The four day trip to the mountain range made it clear to us that precautions have to be taken. Or the mountain will cost you dearly.

Old press releases of the Kremers family on the now defunct Answers for Kris website, showing just how atrocious they were treated at times by the case officials

Thanks to Power Pixie for finding all this information. On the now defunct Answers for Kris website (see an archive version here), they wrote for instance on July 25th of 2014: "The past weeks we, the parents of Kris Kremers, decided to continue the search for answers for Kris on our own initiative. The information shared with us gives rise to many questions and does not yet provide answers. A conclusion about what may have happened cannot be drawn at the moment. For us it has still not been established that they merely 'got lost'. On Friday, July 18, we wanted to conclude the joint part with the remembrance meeting. We cannot emotionally say goodbye to Kris as long as there is so much uncertainty. We will continue to search until we have done everything possible to find answers. It is still unclear to us what happened and the facts are still incomplete and too many 'illogical' steps are presumed to have been taken by our girls, which we cannot explain by their character or the circumstances they may have found themselves in. There is a great desire and need to find out what exactly happened to them and whether others were involved in this after all. For this we need the data that can be retrieved from the telephones and the camera. We are still largely waiting for this, but hope to receive at least part of it next week. In addition, we are counting on the authorities to start that other search for remains in the coming weeks. So we can find more of the girls and finally say goodbye to them. Because the joint part of the search is now being closed, we as parents of Kris Kremers feel the need to launch a new website with which we want to keep the Netherlands, Panama and the media informed about the next steps in this search and the results that this will bring. The Vind Kris en Lisanne foundation will continue to function. We will of course keep the Froon family informed of the progress. The new site will be operational within a few days and will be further supplemented with information."
**On May 29th of 2014, the parents of Kris had already said to local newspaper La Prensa: "My daughter was kidnapped! I don't know by who, but I'm sure she was kidnapped." Kris' parents have repeated this statement in multiple interviews which I cover here in this blog series. 

On August 18th of 2014 the Kremers family wrote
"In recent days it has become clear that the results of the investigation by the Dutch NFI of the backpack that was found, containing the telephones and the digital camera among other things, have still not been handed over to the Panamanian authorities. Our lawyer in Panama, Mr. E. Arrocha, came to this conclusion after a first look at the case file that he has since been handed over by the Public Prosecution Service in Panama, which contains more than a thousand pages. The family would like to urgently request the NFI to hand over this information to the Panamanian authorities, as soon as possible, so that they can be further included in the investigation into answers about what happened to Kris. We hereby make a personal request to the Dutch Forensic Investigators of the NFI (Netherlands Forensic Institute) to release the results of the investigation that is taking place in the Netherlands as soon as possible, and to make them known to the authorities in Panama who - just like the family - are eagerly awaiting them ever since the backpack was discovered. Our lawyer in Panama, Mr. E. Arrocha, has this weekend made an open request in the media to the Dutch Ambassador in Panama, Mr. W. de Boer. He has been asked to take measures and to ensure that the results are sent to Panama as soon as possible. The investigation that is taking place in the Netherlands into the backpack, the telephones and the camera is vital for further investigation into what may have happened. We do not understand why the report has still not been sent, despite knowing that investigations have already taken place and the results are already known. In the unlikely event that there are investigations that have not yet been completed, we request the NFI to share the already established conclusions with the Public Prosecution Service in Panama so that there is no unnecessary delay regarding matters that are already known and can be of help to the current investigation there. Obviously we hope that the NFI will be able to complete the process as quickly as possible and will fully report the Public Prosecution Service. The Kremers family has also received a telephone message from the Dutch Police team that the remains that were found on July 31, 2014 in the river where the backpack was previously found, are partly from Kris Kremers. DNA research has now confirmed this. We are currently still waiting for the written confirmation from the Public Prosecution Service of Panama, in which everything is officially confirmed and which will hopefully make clear what the exact scientific findings are. Of course we hope that more mortal remains will be found as soon as possible, so that this also possibly increases the chance of gaining clarity in what exactly happened to Kris."

On September 1st of 2014 the Kremers family wrote:
(Repeating of quotes already covered in the above timeline) "We have now understood that the much anticipated NFI report is still not in the hands of the public prosecutor in Panama, Betzaida Pitti. According to various media, the NFI (Netherlands Forensic Institute) openly stated on 20 August that the investigation requested by the Panamanian authorities had been completed on 7 August and that the report containing the results of that investigation was sent the same day to the Dutch Prosecution. That message is in conflict with the information that the Dutch Public Prosecution Service provided to the Dutch lawyer of the Kremers family on 14 August 2014 and 20 August 2014, upon request. The Dutch Public Prosecution Service has informed the lawyer of the Kremers family that the investigation by the NFI would not be fully completed yet. The Dutch Public Prosecution Service announced that it would act on the request for legal assistance from Panama and that it would have been agreed with the Panamanian authorities that all research results would be made available to the Panamanian authorities in one go via the Dutch Ministry of Security and Justice. [..] The Dutch ambassador in Panama has had the research results for ten days now, but he has still not made those research results available to the Panamanian authorities. The family understood from the Panamanian authorities that it had been agreed initially and that it was also necessary at that time that the investigation results should be made available to the Panamanian authorities in this way. However, due to the deteriorating weather conditions in Panama, the Panamanian authorities have cleared the way for the digital transmission of the research results in the meantime. The Dutch Public Prosecution Service (OM) has apparently not been able or willing to cooperate with this and has now made the investigation results available to the Dutch ambassador in Panama via the initially agreed route. The Dutch ambassador in Panama has now had the investigation results for ten days, but he has still not made the investigation results available to the Panamanian authorities. The lawyer of the Kremers family in Panama - as well as the public prosecutor in Panama - has already tried several times to contact the Dutch ambassador, so that the investigation results quickly end up in the right place. However, the Kremers family has understood that the Dutch ambassador in Panama has not responded at all these urgent requests, let alone that the investigation results (which have been available for almost a month now) have already been made available to the Panamanian authorities. Meanwhile, the lawyer of the Kremers family in the Netherlands has also submitted a request to the OM to make the available investigation results - as far as possible - available digitally to the Panamanian authorities. This is important not only to be able to continue the investigation in Panama, but also because of the fact that the results of the investigation can only be made available to the Kremers family by the Panamanian authorities

“Here we again feel that they are giving us the runaround and that we're being kept in suspensewhile we are simply trying to find out what happened to our daughter and how she died. There seems to be little empathy among people in the Netherlands who are involved in this research and who apparently cannot understand themselves that it goes beyond the bounds of decency to treat families in this way. Since the beginning of April we have now been trying to retrieve telephone data and we have made this clear time and time again to the various parties involved. We simply do not understand that such a report then disappeared first in a drawer somewhere, until we send out a press release with a plea; and then its release is again delayed by a Dutch embassy, ​​while the authorities in Panama are just as desperate for it as the family. We also understand from Ms Pitti that there may also be alternative and faster ways to get such a report on her desk if they choose so. We hope that the Dutch authorities will soon come to their senses and that not only the Panamanian authorities may receive the report electronically today, but that we, as a family in the Netherlands, will also be added to the mailing list. So that we can have the information in our hands today, after chasing after it for more than four and a half months now. When they state in the Netherlands that it is only a case of the girls simply having gotten lost, and they no longer want to investigate the cause, then there is also no longer any reason or research interest for not disclosing this report immediately to those close to the girls. We expect that after this press release, the authorities concerned will finally understand that the matter is still very urgent for the family, not least because the weather is getting worse by the day in Panama where the rainy season will now soon erupt in its full glory, significantly diminishing the chances of finding Kris' remains. And with that also the chances of finding answers, which may wash away with the rising water. In recent weeks we've been told more and more by authorities; "You cannot accept the death of your daughter and are holding on to straws against your better judgement." It's not so that we as a family cannot accept that Kris is gone. But we cannot accept that not everything is done to find out how she died and why she died. If only to hopefully save this fate for other families. That's why we now want to get to the bottom of what went wrong, as much as this is possible. This isn't the first time this has happened to a family in Boquete and if we don't act now, it may neither be the last. You wouldn't wish this on your worst enemy! Searching for answers for Kris is the last thing we can do now in her name and we will not fail to do so, even if no one else can see the importance of that.”

On September 9th of 2014 the Kremers family wrote
"Both in the Netherlands and Panama, we are still waiting for the full report from the NFI (Netherlands Forensic Institute). The NFI allegedly investigated the phones and did DNA tests on the backpack and other items found on June 14th in Panama. In addition, overall we have also still not received any new DNA reports about the previously found remains, for example of Kris' jeans. We understand that on Friday, August 29th, mortal remains were again found by Indians in Panama. This makes it clear that you can no longer speak about a find that is accidentally made by Indians who accidentally pass by. We would therefore once again like to urge the authorities to keep to the promise already made to us and also in the media in June, namely that they will carry out a serious, extensive search along the river at the place where remains have been found before and where new finds continue to be made. So that we are able to repatriate as many remains as possible to the Netherlands. So far no such serious action has taken place on their behalf. We want to make sure that everything we will receive eventually, will also be everything that could be found with the full efforts of the authorities! As a family, we cannot say goodbye and bury remains of our loved once they are released, if it is at the same time highly likely that new remains can be found the next week. But this is actually what is happening in reality now. It is terribly difficult for us as parents and brothers, but also for uncles, aunts and friends to realize that 2 months in, so many remains of Kris have not been found and that they are lying somewhere along a river where people apparently do regularly pass.

We want for the authorities to now finally indicate to us when they will carry out their promise and actually start looking for the remains of Kris. If there will be no new search, executed with the full commitment from the authorities, then we would like to be informed about this right now so that we as a family can set up a decent search ourselves. In order to end this nightmare and the unbearably persistent uncertainty under which we have been living since April 1st. More than two months have now passed since the backpack was found and we know exactly where we have to be, but still we have hardly received any information about the phones or other information. For example, location data can be used to determine exactly where we need to be and whether we can continue the investigation with that new factual information. It is incomprehensible that this information is still not shared with our lawyers.

On March 4th of 2015 the Kremers family wrote
"Kris and Lisanne likely had a deadly accident near the Pianista trail, according to a team of forensic specialistsAt the beginning of January a team including forensic specialists, members of the Rescue Dogs Foundation RHWW and specialists from the Panamanian authorities traveled again to Boquete Panama, in order to complete a final search for answers there. The search was initiated by the Kremers family, on behalf of both families and with the support of the 'Vind Kris and Lisanne Foundation'. The assignment was to organize one last search to find as many remains of the girls as possible. In addition to the search for remains, the team of forensic specialists has carried out an extensive analysis of various scenarios that are considered most likely. The team of specialists, experienced in searching for mortal remains and in the investigation of crime scenes, has searched the catchment area of ​​several rivers that all flow into the Culebra River, where the belongings and remains of Kris and Lisanne were previously found. Given the amount of time that has since passed and the rapidly changing water levels, the chance of ever finding more remains is very small. The fast flowing water takes everything with it and regularly refreshes the entire catchment area. The team, assisted by the local guides and residents, have walked the Pianista trail, like Kris's parents did did last August. That getting lost on this trail is very unlikely is now also confirmed by these specialists. Frank van der Goot led the team during the tour and says: "The area where some things are supposed to have taken place, simply does not lend itself to getting lost. Anyone who still considers it a realistic possibility nowadays that they got lost, has certainty never physically traversed this particular route themself."

The scenario surrounding a crime was also thoroughly checked. Frank van der Goot was outspoken about this: "The geographical conditions, the social conditions and the technical facts as emerged from the forensic investigation, make a crime in the form of a robbery, sex crime, violent crime or kidnapping very unlikely."

What remains for Frank van der Goot is a fatal accident, possibly caused by an unfortunate fall. “The last part of the descent of the Pianista in particular has geographic possibilities of falling. Assuming a fall from these slopes, the foreland of the faller(s) lies in the bed of one of the rivers that flow into the Culebra river. The conditions in the riverbed correspond to the photos found on the found camera. A fall is also a conclusion that could fit with the results of the investigation of the remains that were found.”

The rescue dogs team and the Panamanian authorities have tried to approach the site where items and remains were found, but had to stop the search due to bad weather. Despite the enormous effort and willingness of the people of the RHWW Foundation, it was impossible to search. What this search did yield was the fact that a person involved who knows the area very well, has viewed the dark photos. He had not been given opportunity earlier. He came to the conclusion that the forensic specialists pointed out and where they believe the accident took place. Although nothing can be determined with certainty, due to the limited leads available, the team of forensic specialists believes it most likely that Kris and Lisanne were killed as a result of a fatal accident in which they may have slid down a slope. Climbing back up was out of the question without proper aids. Frank van der Goot:“There is an enormous height difference of 30-40 metres in the event of a fall at this spot, which makes the risk of injury very likely. Moreover, the stream is surrounded on both sides by waterfalls and the riverbed is surrounded by a steep rock face of a few metres.” [Scarlet: it is a real shame that this spot has never been photographed and published as such]. The place where this may have happened has been designated by several persons, independent of each other, acting without any self-interest. Now that we have also received confirmation from the NFI that the remains found are from Kris, we can actually arrange a funeral. As a family we are relieved that we finally have a possible and plausible explanation for all the questions we had about Kris's death. We would like to thank everyone who has worked hard to find an answer to the question of what could have happened to Kris and Lisanne since their disappearance on April 1st last year. Big thanks for their dedication and commitment to working with us to achieve this result."

Notwithstanding this clear last press release, I understand from later statements from people like Dick Steffens and later interviews from the Kremers family, that overtime they seem to still be left with some doubts about what ultimately happened to Kris and Lisanne. Regarding Frank van der Goots case statements, Tharindu wrote me: "After reading those press releases of the Kremers family regarding the delayed NFI report, I'm not sure what was going on behind the curtain. Even the forensic specialists like Frank van der Goot conveyed in "Lost in the Wild" episode that Kris and Lisanne encountered something else rather than getting lost or having an accident. If they actually had fallen from a height of 30-40m, it must be a weird accident like selfie accident (falling from heights) but where?" -  Yes, and the strangest thing about Frank van der Goots initial claims, is that he never pointed out this supposed cliff where they must have fallen. He was pretty specific initially; it had to be a significant fall. At the bottom of this ravine of sorts, a river had to cross to enable the remains to be washed away. It's not like the entire trail is surrounded by such specific cliffs. Why hasn't he made a photo of his designated spot? Or have a camera team film it? No. Instead it's all rather vague, but a lot of people run with it nevertheless. To me it is nothing more than a wishful theory therefore. And yes, a very odd accident indeed then, and one which could break the healthy 21-year olds pelvic bone, but not leave a single scratch on their sunglasses and camera... No blood anywhere either. No blood remnants on the clothes or bag, not even microscopic ones. No drag marks, nothing. It's just not a very convincing conclusion I think, all in all. Here are the statements of Frank van der Goot in his most recent media performance regarding this case:



    Olha querida.
    Eu depois de acompanhar testemunhos de existe atrizes do mundo porno.

    Chego a conclusão que existe o trafico de mulheres para o porn.

    Porque eu vejo mulheres maduras LINDISSIMAS no portão?
    Que obviamente pelo bio tipo deveriam estar muito bem casadas?

    Ou um bom emprego?
    Como foram parar na industria pornográfica?

    Acredito que são rapitadas você entende?

    Uma bela mulher desde nova vai ter pretendentes e oportunidades.

    Não tem sentido elas irem pra industria porn.
    Onde são forçadas a fazer as piores coisas.
    A usarem drogas e serem ameaçadas.

    Onde uma mulher fica numa cena, cercada por 8 a 10 homens.

    Então acho que o governo do panamá entregou as 2 holandesas para a elite pornô.

  2. I am fairly confident, given all the warnings they had beforehand to stay on the trail, that they left the trail and stumbled across a "Nueva Luz de Dios" (or similar, non-Spanish speaking indigenous) ceremonial religious site and "desecrated it" in entering it or touching things in it. I think they were being watched and were captured and sacrificed by that religion/cult. Later, their property and bones were placed back out along the trail. The Panama government is very aware of the human sacrificing issue and the cult and tends to cover up their activities.