Update November 3rd 2022You can listen to a new extensive podcast series here or here. The makers, journalists Mariana Atencio and Jeremy Kryt, a well known name in this investigation and author for the Daily Beast, went to Boquete to investigate there. They spoke to locals and gathered more information. In an interview, Mariana explained: "This story called me. There were elements about what supposedly happened to the women that didn’t add up. Kryt pointed to new evidence suggesting foul play: Kris and Lisanne may have been intercepted and assaulted on the hike". Their reporting involved nearly a month in the field – riding horses and reaching key areas only by helicopter – and camping where the women likely went missing. So far I find it a professionally made and enthralling podcast. Below I will write out some interesting details from the first two available episodes. If you are new to this case, I advise you to listen to the podcast in its entirety for full context. And I would like to advise everybody else to do the same, as it is a great listen. Please scroll further down for a point by point summary of this podcast series' main findings. You can also find far more commentary from myself on the findings and on remaining questions if you scroll down this post.
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[Ep 1.] THE PIANISTA The journalists hiked the Pianista themselves and they did so on April 1st 2022. Great to have a description of the trail and the circumstances at that exact same time of year. On the terrible anniversary also of this disappearance. Some of the journalists findings: It is still not obvious on the Mirador now, in 2022, that you reached the end of the trail and have to turn around and go back down. They lose cell reception minutes into their descent down the other side of the mountain, beyond the Mirador. Twenty minutes into that descent they try to call 911, but they cannot make a connection. The call is not going through. This trail beyond the Mirador is very rocky and is muddy when Kryt and Atencio are there. The gully has rock walls, and the makers confirm that you really only can go forward or backwards. No way out when you are in danger. 'Running, you would fall and hurt yourself'. A local man on the trail tells them that it is getting dark and that the trail is too dangerous to descend at night, and that he will take shelter in one of the scattered sheds in the area until sunlight. This highlights the possibility that if Kris and Lisanne also realised by 17:00 that they wouldn't make it back to Boquete before nightfall and were not in the position to make a successful phone call for help, they could have tried to find shelter up the mountain. Jeremy Kryt and Mariana Atencio went to Boquete and interviewed Martina as well. To them she stated that she did see Kris and Lisanne going up the trail, and that she never thought they would disappear after that. When asked what she believes has happened to them, she answered that 'there was definitely someone who killed them'. She doesn't know who, but that it definitely was not due to the river that they died. And that it is all government lies, to say they drowned in the river. She says that right after the girls got lost, a man - a local guide, F. - essentially told her to shut up about this case and not talk to anyone about the fact that she had seen the Dutch girls. You can hear about this in episode 1 of 7 here. Jeremy Kryt and Mariana Atencio state that Martina is afraid of the guide and that he threatened her with jail time 'for telling the truth'. She is visibly shaking and asks the two journalists to protect her.
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[Ep 2.] THE SEARCH Kryt and Atencio have the official case files in their possession, consisting of 5 overstuffed envelopes with nearly 3000 pages. "There is one name that pops up again and again and again. Guide F." Guide F. refuses until this day to talk to Kryt, as he 'dislikes Americans'. Kryt confirms that "some locals paint him as a saint who did everything he could to help find Kris and Lisanne, while other locals, including several other tour guides, believe he was in some way responsible for their deaths". But the case files highlight just what a large role he played in this whole saga. "He has a starring role in the initial investigation into Kris and Lisanne's disappearance, and he led the charge in the massive search that followed. And when precious little physical evidence was finally recovered in this case, their belongings, bones and body parts, this evidence will be found by people connected to him. Either employees or relatives. Practically in his own back yard." The two journalists quote guide F. as saying in an interview, that on April 1st he got a phone call from the language school, where he had earlier that day seen Kris and Lisanne (hammock, 'Hola!'). And that one of the employees called him to make a last minute appointment for Kris and Lisanne to tour a local farm. Guide F: "They call me to tell me the two young women I had seen at the school wanted to go to Mister Filo's Farm (?) in Alto Quiel. I didn't have any commitments the next day, so I told her I'd pick them up at 8 o'clock in the morning at the school. That's what we agreed on." Mariana Atencio says she finds this strange. This appointment was made at a time when Kris and Lisanne were already out there, on their Pianista hike. She assumes that the employee from the language school booked this tour, but never told Kris and Lisanne about it. But I think that Eileen and Kris and Lisanne (are said to have) made an appointment among themselves for this Wednesday tour before Kris and Lisanne got their hiking boots and went out towards Nelvis and the Pianista trail. And I guess that timeline kind of fits. Then the two journalists continue to quote guide F. in an article that was translated into English first: "I arrived at school at 8 in the morning. The German girl was standing outside the school, waiting for me. Ready, with her little backpack. We talked for a few minutes, maybe 5 minutes, and she told me: 'These girls aren't coming. They are usually on time'. And as a joke, not thinking they would be missing for long, I told her: 'They might usually show up on time, but they can't be as punctual as you Germans.' She told me 'No, they are usually on time'." [Scarlet: How did Eileen know this? She barely spent time with Kris and Lisanne prior? She basically knew them from the shuttle bus ride to Boquete and from them visiting the language school.]
Guide F. and Eileen then headed towards Miriam's place. Miriam Guerra is said here to be a friend of guide F. That he knew exactly where they were staying. And that it was a symbiotic business arrangement for all involved. 'Travelers would come to Boquete, study at the language school, sightsee with guide F. and stay at his friend's house down the street'. About entering the girls' bedroom, guide F. said: "To our surprise we found some things on the bed. A backpack and some sandals, falling onto the floor." The article states that he called Miriam again to let her know that the girls were not in their room. "She was very surprised. She had been waiting until 11 at night to have dinner with them. And after some time she decided to go to sleep, because she had to get up early the next day for work. She had left breakfast for them the next morning and thought: if they come home late, they will also wake up late". [Scarlet: So she never checked herself in the morning to see if these girls got back safe or not.... She was surprised to hear from guide F. that their room was empty.. And why not simply call them on their phone the evening before, to ask them if they will share dinner or not and if all is OK with them?] In this same interview, guide F. blames Eileen for not going to the police right away. "She said: maybe they are running into some problems, or they were with friends at night and didn't come back for whatever reason. They most likely come back during the day. I told her we should tell the police. She told me: If we were in Germany, we would have to wait 24 hours. I told her that in Panama, it is basically the same system." Mariana then confirms that Eileen and guide F. did go to the farm together that afternoon, but asked rangers along the way if they had seen Kris and Lisanne. And later, back in Boquete, they together checked again in the school and at Miriam's place if the girls had come back. Eileen is said to then remember that she saw Kris and Lisanne checking out a trail map of the Pianista the day before. On Thursday morning (April 3rd) guide F. rallied friends and tour guides to help find Kris and Lisanne. Eileen suggests they may have hiked the Pianista and police find Pianista searches on the school's computer.
Jose Donderis, former national head of Sinaproc says: "The initial investigation of these young women was not in the hands of professionals". He personally participated in the searches and the case still haunts him. He calls the investigation a disaster. Too much precious time was wasted on scouring every tourist walking trail in the area, instead of focusing on the Pianista trail. But it took time to interview the people living on the Pianista trail, in order to get a clear image of things. There was rain and even storms during the first weeks of searching. After several days of searching and finding nothing, they were quickly very worried about not finding them alive. Guide F. searched the Pianista twice, we are told here. Initially all the way to the Rio Culebra. "He went as far as the Mirador on April 3rd and hours beyond it to the Rio Culebra on April 5th." And found nothing. [Scarlet: But didn't we hear in the Answers for Kris video from him and the Kremers family that guide F. went already as far as the paddock, aka the meadow, on Thursday April 3rd?] Jose Donderis believes they went off trail therefore. But Jose says Sinaproc just searched the trails, over and over, and did not search the jungle itself.. Sinaproc never left the beaten paths, he claims. Jose Donderis also confirms that there is plenty of clean water to be found in the jungle to survive on, and that thát region has also plenty of shelter. Even the locals sleep in the many sheds scattered in the area, if need be. And it still pains Jose that the search was suspended already within 2 weeks. He felt like leaving them behind and says it is unprecedented really. No explanation as to why they stopped so early, and by the sound of it against all common practice. Jose Donderis also states that in his entire career, he never encountered a situation yet in which not one but two hikers, out together, both had an accident and injury at the same time. Marcus' statement of hearing women screaming on April 5th was actually reported to Sinaproc. They noted it down. Although the podcast makers fail to add that Marcus did not witness all this on the Pianista trail, but a fair bit away from there. Read more about Marcus here.
Martin Ferrara O'Donnell is also interviewed. He worked on this disappearance case as a private detective of sorts, funded partly by expats in Boquete and he gathered a big case file himself over time. He stresses that the statements of the duo (Irma and Luis) who found the backpack in June, show inconsistencies. There already were the different circulating stories that the bag was either found in a rice paddy, or was found stuck in the middle of the river, underneath some rocks. But Irma said that she was alone at the river when she found the backpack and went home to show it to her husband, Luis. Whereas Luis has testified that he was right there at the river when Irma saw the bag and took it along. Martin Ferrara O'Donnell stresses that this exact place at the river next to the rice paddy is a two hour walk from their house in Alto Romero. So a two hour walk is hard to forget.. Why don't their stories line up? And as the podcast makers discuss in their Aftershow for episodes 1 and 2: Irma and Luis also both declared to police that it was the very first time they went to this rice paddy. It says so in the police files. But does that make sense? Who normally worked on that rice paddy then? Why walk at least two hours to go to this specific spot (to wash your clothes?) and what are the odds of ending up exactly where that backpack was supposedly lodged in the river? Seeing it by chance as Irma was doing her thing? That makes very little sense. Then there is the phone call that Boquete police got the next morning, informing them about the discovery of the bag. It wasn't Luis (or Irma) who called, but a man called Domingo Gonzalez. Brother of guide F. Domingo the cattle ranger.. And as I have reported on all along, Irma and Luis are indeed employees of guide F. and his family, who own land in the Alto Romero region and employ several of the villagers. Why has this connection always been kept under wraps in the media and by certain reporters and investigators? Certain writers and Pittí defenders have whitewashed guide F's involvement completely, and even went as far as to obscure the name of his brother, who collected the backpack and called the police on behalf of the Alto Romero couple. Who would have guess that "José D.G." (Pitti's defenders) actually stands for José Domingo Gonzalez. Brother of guide F.? That kind of makes it a more interesting story. I can see why they tried to hide that connection by abbreviating that name. Now the idea creeps up that Domingo could theoretically have been involved in telling them what to do and say here.. But they got some details of their story wrong. Ferrara O'Donnell believes the couple planted the bag there, on instruction of the Gonzalez family. The two journalists also interview a long term neighbour from guide F. in Alto Romero.
Guide Tony. He says that guide F. has had his farm for a long time. He is a wealthy landowner by Panamanian standards, with a lot of influence and power. Especially over the Ngäbe-Buglé residents he employs. "The local indigenous people feel scared when they are threatened. And even more so because they work inside the community for him. He didn't have any authority he lorded over them until now. After what happened to the Dutch women." Tony adds that guide F. desperately wants to keep this case quiet. And tells everybody in Alto Romero NOT to talk about it anymore [I guess that is what the Travel Channel crew also experienced firsthand when they were there a few years ago]. Does that indicate that guide F. threatening Martina who lives on the Pianista trail, wasn't just a fluke? Tony: "He talks to others about this case, saying it was an accident. If he has nothing to fear, why is he threatening others not to talk?" [I hope Tony stays safe after this podcast interview]. Tony was also present when police came to Alto Romero by helicopter and opened the backpack. He saw it and says that despite being wet, the backpack was in "pretty decent shape". Having extensively been exposed to the jungle for ten weeks, it had held up. It was damaged, but intact. "I saw when they took out the cellphones and money, all those things. They were full of water. They took them out of the plastic bags and they were full of water. I'm not too familiar with camera systems, but I think they were functioning, because the photos inside the camera came to light afterwards." Shouldn't the backpack have fallen apart after months in the river, potentially? Local backpacker George calls the state of the backpack 'a huge red flag'. Too convenient how it was found and its state not representing it's supposed long stay out in the elements. It should have completely disintegrated. "Our rainy season, we get 24 to 30 inches a month. So sixty days being out in the rains... heavy rains, I think that was an interesting find. It was too good to be true. And way too late." Too late to save Kris and Lisanne, or steer the investigation in a good direction. Where had that backpack been all that time, in the middle of the flowing river? And Dave M. wrote me some more interesting words about the state of the backpack: "Jeremy tells how one of the witnesses who saw the backpack being opened says that the electronics (phones, camera) were in zip-locked plastic bags. It is impossible to say whether this is 100% true, but Jeremy notes that this is a popular protective strategy used by guides to carry their own electronics. Kris and Lisanne, dressed in their summer lightweight gear, would seem to be unlikely to think of such preparation on the face of it. Plus we know that the two brought out their phones and camera on a regular basis. So whether this story is true or not is open to your own interpretation. Still, I myself first heard of the goods being found in a plastic bag inside the backpack three or four years ago now. I took this to be a regular carrier bag, one of the red ones common to shops in the area. And when you think about the night photos in this respect, it is a little odd to think that Lisanne and Kris wouldn't have used such plastic carrier bags as a part of their SoS strategies, or some other protective purpose... And as Power-Pixie replied: "Interesting that it is a strategy employed by guides to shield their electronics from the rain. Most likely another Freudian slip by guide F. and company." In the Aftershow for the first two episodes, Kryt and Atencio mention. Ok, that were episodes 1 and 2 covered. Five more to come :)
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[Ep 3.] RIO CULEBRAKryt and Atencio hike the Pianista trail and beyond. They detail various theories that exist about the pattern of Kris and Lisanne's phone use after April 1st. A specialist says that people who are lost in the wild tend to use their phone to look for signal, but at the same time tend to try to save phone battery for as long as possible. [Something which Kris and Lisanne may also have done, with the exception of Lisanne, who kept hér Samsung phone powered on overnight on April 3rd, without making real use of it]. People also tend to split up if one of a duo had an accident, with the other normally feeling the urge to find help. Mariana Atencio states that 'it rained a lot in the days after they disappeared'. [Scarlet: I hear that more often but have not seen the weather data to confirm this. From what I gathered at the time, the week after their disappearance there was minimal rain. But there were strong winds, interfering with the helicopter plans]. While out in the wild, the presenters' satellite phone fails to connect at some point, which causes a short-lived panic. Despite them being out there with a significant team of people and supplies. The group hikes to the Rio Culebra, to the second monkey bridge. It took them 3 miles and 3 walking hours from the location of photo 508 to get here. So Kryt and Atencio disagree here with the presenters from Lost in the Wild, from the Travel Channel, who stated that Kris and Lisanne could not have ended up at a river crossing by the time the first two emergency calls were made. Kryt and Atencio disagree with this and state that they themselves reached that spot in three walking hours. Meaning that if they had left the location of photo 508 at 14.00 PM, they would have arrived at the river crossing by 17:00. Which would still be 21 minutes later than the time of the first emergency call; 16:39 PM, but would be relatively close in time. The presenters fail to state if that timeframe would allow for reaching the 1st river crossing point. They look for the night photo location. In contrast to what some investigators believe, Kryt and Atencio ultimately do not believe that the lines from this cable bridge can be seen in the background of night photo #550. Eric Johnson, a court certified photo analyst, also takes a look at photo #550 and says that he also does not believe there is a cable bridge visible in the photo. Johnson: "What happens at night in particular, there is something called noise. And that introduces artefacts in an image. Especially if you try to process an image or lighten it up, using a photo editing program So you can see more detail in dark areas." The Panamanian authorities lightened photo #550 and what you see according to Johnson, is that they "lightened noise". "It's garbage". "I would not speculate that there is anything in that darker area. The flash on that particular camera is only good for 11 feet maximum. And that's under good conditions. I don't see a monkey bridge there". When asked if he sees what could have been mistaken for a monkey bridge, Johnson answers: "Honestly, I do not". Ouch... "And I sat and stared at this picture for quite a while. Sometimes it's kind of like people looking at the clouds, trying to see what you hope to see". So this kind of takes the ground further away under the theory that Kris and Lisanne were holed up near this monkey bridge. Not that many sane people still believed that theory from the official investigators... Johnson also states that the flash on this particular Canon camera was only good for about 11 feet (3,3 meters). And the river itself is about 60 feet across (18 meter), so there is no way that this night photo was even taken on the Culebra river, which is far too wide for the photo to pick up on the opposite riverbank. They have to be in a much narrower river canyon for the flash to pick up on the opposite river wall. The podcast makers also confirm that a handful of people, locals, cross these bridges every day. And that the rescue workers searched those trails, including the bridges, extensively. Kryt believes that the flora seen in the night photos, the specific types of ferns and such, point strongly to the night photo location being on the other side of the Mirador. Not on the Boquete side of the mountain.
The makers also confirm what was already known about the Canon camera; that if you try to focus this camera in the dark, a little green light comes on. If you press the shutter just short enough, the flash light will come on before a picture is actually taken. That way you can use it as a torch. Perhaps that explains the flurry of mostly random looking night photos. It is confirmed again that Betzaida Pitti and her team idiotically altered the images on the original SD card with their photo editing actions [unbelievable...]. She had the original images photoshopped, rotated, brightened and SAVED this in the original SD card. That is criminal negligence and inexcusable stupidity in my book. Or calculated corruption. [What else was permanently changed on that SD card? All done on June 17th, so before the Dutch NFI officials even had a chance to look at the SD card for the first time]. Pittí & Co may have even removed photo 509 in the process. What I missed in this episode, is Kryt and Atencio looking back on Kryt's initial article claims that there is blood visible in photo #580. That was a huge claim at the time, and Kryt was criticized for it, especially once Juan published the unfiltered entire photo. No blood is visible. I would have liked to hear the podcast makers come back on that early claim and explain to the listener why Kryt believed at the time that he saw blood in the photo original he had access to already back then.
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[Ep 4.] THE REMAINS This episode reflects on previous Daily Beast articles of Kryt. The podcast makers catch up with some people he interviewed back in 2016 already as well. Some interesting bits and pieces I wrote down when listening this podcast episode were that locals from Alto Romero were paid by authorities to look for Kris and Lisanne, on their behalf. Tour guide F. was present when several of their remains were found. Nothing was found for 2,5 months, and then suddenly after the backpack was discovered, all sorts of other remains showed up. Jose Donderis, former head of Sinaproc, still thinks that Kris and Lisanne got lost and followed the river, believing it would bring them back to civilisation. When in fact the Rio Culebra goes deeper into the jungle and leads eventually to the Caribbean Sea, on the other side of the country. And he believes that a flooded river dragged them to their deaths. Jose does say that the condition in which the (few) remains were found is peculiar. He has seen it all, but nothing like this. He says: "In my 30+ years of experience, we found bodies that are naked with marks from animals. But we've never seen bodies dismembered". The coroner who personally did the autopsies of their remains, believes until this day that Kris and Lisanne were murdered. This forensic anthropologist agrees to an interview under identity protection. "Because he fears for his life". He believes his life is in danger. They meet in a hotel in David and he explains that from his perspective, the killer is still out there in Boquete. When asked if the bones showed evidence that Kris and Lisanne met an accidental death, he says: "I do not agree with the state theory, because of the low percentage of skeletal remains that we have. We can't say that this was an accident. Rather, based on my experience in Mexico, I would think that this was the result of criminal activity." But the autopsy reports which he wrote eight years ago, are inconclusive. He was not able to scientifically determine a cause of death for either Kris or Lisanne. "Upon initial review, the causes or mechanisms of death can not be established, precisely because of the low percentage of remains found." So there is no scientific proof for either an accident or a murder. "Human interference is far simpler, but I didn't find evidence. Neither did the team from the Netherlands". He won't share more information. But he says: "I still don't think it was an accident. I've always had the suspicion there could be a laboratory in Boquete that conducts various forms of trafficking. Not only drug trafficking; organ trafficking, human trafficking, prostitution in different kind of ages. Which is a very lucrative business. You can drain a person completely of blood and sell it for 1000 dollars or more." Jeremy Kryt says that he found no evidence whatsoever of such a lab in Boquete, and that he believes the view of the coroner may be coloured by his previous experience and work specialism in Mexico, namely with organized crime. But sex trafficking actually taking place in Boquete seems more realistic to Kryt. Like other law enforcement people who Kryt and Atencio spoke with, the coroner expresses worry about corruption in Panama.. Also corruption related to the Kremers-Froon case, with a deliberate attempt to make it all go away and sweep it under the rug. The coroner tells them that he had quit 'over the way the department conducted itself and the corruption'.
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Forensic anthropologist and archeologist Dr. Georgina Pacheco takes a look at the autopsy reports of Kris and Lisanne. She is the only forensic anthropologist of Costa Rica. She agrees that there is not enough information available to conclude how they died. "You don't have the whole body, you don't have the whole context of what happened. And it could be homicide, we don't know. It could be accidental, we don't know either." She clarifies that she didn't see the actual remains, but gives her opinion on the autopsy reports and the pictures that she saw. From Lisanne's autopsy report, she confirms that they found her left femur, left tibia, left foot that was inside a sock. There was a lot of soft tissue present still and even nail paint was discovered. She says it is fairly normal that a foot remains this well preserved when it is still inside a sock. And it is also pretty easy for a foot to get separated from the leg bone. "Hands and feet are always the first to go. Because the bones are smaller, and because there is not a lot of soft tissue that surrounds these extremities". This left foot and leg could have easily separated from the body naturally. No evidence was found in the autopsy report that it was removed by force. "There are no cut marks found on the foot or on the tibia for example". Georgina Pacheco also says that there is NO mentioning of a fracture of Lisanne's foot in the autopsy reports. "From what I've read, there is no trauma at all in any of the bones". The only remains from the autopsy report of Kris Kremers involve a rib and the left coxal bone (= from the pelvic bone). This is very minimal, when considering how many bones a human body consists of. Out of those 206 bones, we can only analyse two bones for Kris. And there is very little to say, based on only those two bones. The pelvic bone shows evidence of scavenging. Meaning that animals may have eaten soft tissue or helped spread her remains. Pacheco says that the two bones of Kris do not show the same rate of decomposition. The pelvic bone looked normal for the amount of time it had been out there in the jungle. But Kris' rib bone did not. Georgina says that the rib bone had a stark white colour. Almost as if it had been bleached. But she also says that different parts of the body can show different decomposition rates. But the state of Kris' rib goes beyond that. Georgina discards the notion that sun exposure could have done this to the rib. "To get bone this white, to have bone bleached this white by sun exposure, you need a lot of time. More months, even years. Maybe if the body decomposed within days, and the remains were exposed to the sun every day, then you can may, maybe." [But the rain season started in fact, soon after their disappearance]. The soil decomposition could in theory also be a factor. She cannot exclude human intervention, but cannot prove it either. Chemical decomposition of the bodies by a 3rd party makes no sense to Georgina, as only one body (Kris') would then have been treated, but not the other. That is confusing. She believes it may have been dead by accident/natural causes, and that the rest of their bodies simply are still out there in the jungle.Laureano Bejerano was among the locals who found remains of Kris and Lisanne. Kryt and Atencio go back to him to ask if he remembers anything specific. He also has both a place in town and a finca behind the Pianista trail. Laureano is quite drunk when the two arrive late in the evening, seems suddenly unwilling to do the agreed on interview and even calls his friend guide F. to tell him that they are there, asking questions about the case... Laureano had been one of Jeremy's helpers back in 2016, but when the two meet this time around he is nervous, and wants to call guide F. to make sure he is allowed to speak to Kryt... Peculiar. For a grown man and successful guide in his own right to feel the need to call on this other guide, in order to make sure he isn't speaking out of turn about what happened in 2014. Laureano then says off-camera that in the days after the backpack was found, locals including him and guide F., as well as people who work for the family of guide F. [does that include Irma and her husband?] were paid to search the area around the Rio Culebra. They had orders to only search the river. Not anywhere else. Laureano and guide F. were both present when the foot in the boot of Lisanne were found, as well as when the pelvic bone of Kris was found. They were also both present when Kris' denim shorts was found and the blue shoe. Laureano does not want to explain who precisely found these items and where exactly. He says he was warned not to talk to anyone about what he found. Mariana Atencio makes an appointment with two European tourists to do a tour with guide F. 'Undercover'. She receives a message on her private email, stating only "Kill".
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Mariana agreed with German tourists Jacky and Caroline to pose as friends and book a tour with guide F. Under that guise she wants to pose him some casual questions about Kris and Lisanne. Shortly after, she receives a message from what appears to be an American number, only spelling out "Kill". It freaks her out. She feels watched in Boquete and thinks it may even come from guide F. She goes through with the meeting with guide F., but treats it almost like she is going to interview a terrorist leader, with a team in a car outside watching her every move inside a public place. Jeremy Kryt can't join as guide F. knows his face and has previously visited Kryt in his hotel to threaten him. So he is out for this undercover operation of sorts. Jeremy Kryt recalls that he met him during his first Daily Beast trips to Boquete, where the guide (unexpectedly?) visited the hotel Kryt was staying at and "Flew into quite a rage." Kryt recalls that the hotel he stayed at back then had actually barred guide F. due to his 'inappropriate behaviour with female tourists'. [Was guide F's self-pitying fightback interview in the Dutch press three or so months ago perhaps a reaction to Kryt's return to Boquete?] During the chat the three women have with guide F., he is charming and friendly and does not dodge the trio's questions about the Pianista trail and Kris and Lisanne, confirming that their case is "very real". And that he was part of the search group, starting the search and rescue himself, and also was involved in the discovery of their remains. Including the boot. He also said that he reported them missing. And that their decision to hike that trail alone was "dangerous". "Women shouldn't go alone." Guide F. also 'brags' to them about all his Dutch clients and is proud to showcase his German and Dutch vocabulary to the trio, calling them "beautiful girls". The beautiful girls take this as him trying to flirt with them. And Mariana says that throughout the meeting, guide F. touched her knee. Unasked. Later she specifies it as "at least five times". He mentioned his stepson 'Tito', nickname for Henry, who is 32 years old now but was 24 back in 2004. Roughly the same age as Kris and Lisanne.
THE SUPPOSED PARTYThe podcast makers talk with another local guide who helped with the searches, Verísimo Fuentes. He confirms to Kryt and Atencio that guide F. owns a ranch close to where the remains of Kris and Lisanne were found. But it is his son, let's call him Tito, who 'has problems'. Appearing tranquil at times, but exploding in violence at other times. "When he is drinking he can become violent. He changes". But then comes a striking next comment: "And he was with the Dutch girls in the discotheque". Verísimo Fuentes states again that Kris and Lisanne were seen in a nightclub with Tito, aka Henry, and his friends on Sunday the 30th of March. And that "many people saw it". He is very sure of this. [Scarlet: unfortunately neither Kris nor Lisanne mentioned this in their diaries, as far as we know. But if we go by the phrase 'The best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour' - thank you Doctor Phil - then looking at their past behaviour in Bocas del Toro, going dancing in the evenings with guys their own age and going swimming with them also, is perhaps also what we could expect from them in Boquete]. Then he continues: "There are FIVE DEAD. Five people were killed in connection to the missing Dutch girls."
"When Tito is drinking he can become violent. He changes. And he was with the Dutch girls in the discotheque".
LA BANDIDA[Or I could have that word wrong and Mariana could also say 'pandilla', which would also refer to a gang. Sorry for not speaking Spanish and possibly having 'bandida' wrong here]. More murders. This is nothing new for Martin Ferrara O'Donnell [who did his own private research in the case of Kris and Lisanne, and believes also that things went south after the girls went to a party; he offered his detective files to various people for a significant price. Read part 2 of my blog for more information on this]. Martin says he has been looking at 'Tito' for years, when it comes to this case. "Because it is very likely that he would have done something like that. He doesn't care about other people's feelings. When he would see a dog in the street, he would get in his car and kill it. He would run them over with his car to kill them." "These are signs of a person who can be considered a psychopath". Interesting. This is namely not the first time 'Tito', aka Henry, has been linked to dog cruelty. See the paragraph below. Martin also names Tito's friends, La Bandida* [or it could be La Pandilla; I will stick to Bandida for now, apologies if I picked the wrong word, it should refer to a criminal local gang of sorts]: "Edwin, Sam John D, Jose Manuel Murgas and Cesar 'La Cuervo' S.". All in their early to mid twenties in 2014. Martin claims he has an anonymous informant who knows that Kris and Lisanne bought drugs from this group of friends from 'Tito'. The testimony is recorded on tape. They wanted to buy some cannabis in Boquete and spoke to a young man. Israel A. They got along and agreed to go out together. And Israel got them in contact with one of the guys of Tito's posse, Sam John D. Then on March 31st, Kris and Lisanne went to a house party in Palo Alto with Tito and his clique, according to Martin. It was held in Césars house. The informant heard these details from Césars neighbour, also from another member of the group and it was also verified by another group member, he claims, who drove by the house and recognized the cars of Sabroson and others there. 'Tito' (Henry) was also there, as well as Israel and Sam John, 'Sabroson' [Edwin A.] and the girls. Martin is particularly skeptical about Tito, the son of guide F. "What's strange to me and suspicious, is that mister Henry G. who was supposedly at the party, that he didn't tell his dad. 'Hey they were with us'. Was there something he was trying to hide? Obviously" Or díd his dad know about this detail perhaps? If so, he has not shared it with the world. Is that guide F's motive for being all over this case, trying to steer it in a certain direction? Away from his son? "It's like Henry's dad is trying to cover something up".
"Tito, he doesn't care about other people's feelings. When he would see a dog in the street, he would get in his car and kill it. He would run them over with his car to kill them."
[Scarlet: Now, parents will usually say that their kids 'don't do drugs'. Which isn't necessarily the truth. I must say that I don't have the impression either that Kris and Lisanne were in the habit of using drugs. So this one surprises me, if true (and it could be gossip). But you cannot always see that on the outside and what's more, we know firsthand from Lisanne's diary how anxious and stressed out she was during her first days in Boquete. Cannabis is very easy to legally buy in the Netherlands, and will usually make you feel more relaxed. So within the context of her self-described state of mind back then, I wouldn't rule out the notion that she would have wanted to buy some weed to feel more relaxed. It is possible that Kris and Lisanne did not realise that weed is not legal in Panama, and that trying to buy it off someone can be dangerous. Is thát perhaps why Kris and Lisanne carried $88 with them on April 1st? To buy some cannabis? If they would buy that from these young lads, they would smoke it at he location. Not bring it back to Miriam's place. You smell weed from meters away. Also, with regards to the 'Tito is a psychopath who kills dogs' comments, there is actually also a gruesome 2014 statement from Websleuths forum member Skidawayme who lives in Boquete, confirming there was at least one psychopath in Boquete then who mutilated dogs, and she seems to refer to 'Tito' as well in other comments: "There have been references every now and then to a possible psycho killing Kris and Lisanne. I work with a Boquete animal welfare group and there have been 2 instances of severe animal cruelty here in the last 6 months or so. Both times it involved dogs and both times they were horrendously mutilated. One dog had to be put to sleep; the other was saved after intensive medical intervention. In both instances, the conclusions of the vet, the rescuers and, I believe though I'm not certain, the police, were that more than one person had to have been involved in order to hold down the dog while the other person used the machete. In the States, this kind of behavior is a marker for later violence against people. Certainly, it takes psychopathic behavior to disembowel one dog and horribly cut another. We do have in Boquete two young men capable of unimaginable violence against helpless animals. So -- how likely is it that there is a sick psychopath here? Answer for yourselves. sk" - Scarlet: Let's not forget that it’s been long established that individuals who have the capability of psychopathically killing people, not rarely start with killing animals. This is a red flag, and it shows murderous traits.]
THE RED PICKUP TRUCKMartin then names another witness who saw Kris and Lisanne with Tito's group that afternoon of March 31st: Osman Valenzuela. "He was on Boquete's town square, and saw a double cabin red pickup truck parked there. He saw Kris and Lisanne sitting in it, along with four members of the Bandida." Martin: "At the park in Boquete he sees a red pickup and he sees mister Edwin 'Sabroson' A. who was driving the car, and mister Sam John D, who is in the passenger seat. In the back of the pickup he sees Henry G. and Jose Manuel Murgas and the two Dutch women sitting in the middle." Osman knew these guys well, and would not have misidentified them. In fact, he wanted to become part of the Pandilla, Martin says. "Mister Osman always wanted to belong to the group. He had that wish to be part of the group". Unfortunately, Osman died four days after seeing the Dutch women in Edwin's red truck. He was found dead in a river "with a suspicious head injury". Officially it was stated that he drowned, but 'it looked like he got some help'. Martin: "In my opinion they hit Osman, and they left him in the river to drown. They ruled that he drowned and it was an accident. BUT, Osman's family fought the verdict, the lawyer did. For the manner in which to be changed. And now, after the fight, the manner of death is [ruled] homicide." [Read part 2 of my blog for more information on this]. In the next podcast, Osman's mother will talk about what she knows... She says for instance: "They killed him because he knew about the Dutch girls. They have no scruples." - So, even officials now ruled Osman's death a murder. Why didn't we know about this until now? Not about Osman claiming to have seen Kris and Lisanne in Edwin's car, and neither about his cause of death having been officially changed? Because corrupt Pittí decided that there is nothing to see here and that Osman nor Jose Manuel, nor Leonardo had anything to do with the unsolved disappearance of Kris and Lisanne?
And within a year another young lad who was seen inside the red truck, Jose Manuel Murgas, was run down by a car. Whereas taxi driver Leonardo, who drove Kris and Lisanne to the Pianista, was found drowned in a shallow river a few weeks before Murgas died. Martin says that the hit and run killing of Jose Manuel Murgas was no accident. "He had blows to the head that are not compatible with a hit and run accident." Two witnesses who came forward made it sound like Murgas was run over on purpose. "A city official from the Alto Boquete area tells me: 'I heard a car pull up and they open it, like a pickup truck door, and they closed it. They backed the car up and they accelerated and drove off'." And another woman, who lives across the street of where the killing happened, heard voices coming from the car. "On the property across the street from where they found mister Jose Manuel Murgas, she says she heard a vehicle. That she stopped and heard some voices, saying 'Hurry up! Leave him there! Throw him, leave him there. Come on, come on, come on!" Martin Ferrara O'Donnell believes that the Bandida of Henry is responsible for all three of these suspicious deaths [and they haven't even touched yet on Jorge Rivera Miranda's suspicious death at the same time, drowning in super shallow water, see photo above]. "As well as for the deaths of Kris and Lisanne". Martin: "The Dutch woman, Lisanne and Kris, were probably in their last minutes with this group of guys. I am certain that mister Osman Valenzuela, in the last minutes of his life, was with this group of guys. I am certain that Jose Manuel Murgas in his last minutes of life was with this group of guys."
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A red pickup truck.. Where did we hear about that one before? Someone saw a red pickup truck near the Pianista on the day that Kris and Lisanne went missing. And Martin Ferrara O'Donnell knows who saw the truck. "It was Mrs. Doris. She tells me she sees the women go up. About twenty to twenty-five minutes later, she sees "a red, double cabin pickup truck" go up and then she sees the red pickup truck go down". Doris is the wife of the Il Pianista restaurant owner. She is 'sick' and cannot talk to the podcast makers. [Scarlet: the sons of the Il Pianista restaurant are also linked to 'Tito's' Bandida...]. But Doris does communicate to the podcast makers that indeed, she saw "a red, double cabin pickup truck" go up and then go down again on the Pianista trail. "With oversized tyres and tinted windows". But there is another witness who saw the pickup truck. It is the sister of Martina (who lives along the Pianista trail and was personally threatened by guide F.), called Anneda. Anneda says she didn't see Kris and Lisanne herself that day, but she did see the red truck: "I didn't see the Dutch girls, I only heard the sound of the car. I saw a car go up, it was a red pickup truck. I was there when I went to hang up some clothes. I didn't see the girls but my sister says, as soon as she was at the end of the road, that she saw them." Anneda also says that "there are many people that kill woman around here." - Police did go after the red pickup truck lead. They didn't end up with Edwin, but instead with a local couple who said they rented out their truck to a local florist, who sent the truck up the Pianista with four young workers in it within the context of a flower fair that was held that day. And with the officials (Pittí) claiming this, I guess that ends the red pickup truck narrative right there and then for most people...
THE SWIMMING PHOTOScarlet: Great episode. I have since long believed that the swimming photo and the five young deaths within a year (Kris, Lisanne, Osman, Jose Manuel and Leonardo) may all link together and could actually point towards what really happened to them. I write about this swimming photo in great detail HERE in my part 2 blog post, right at the top. You can also find recent updates about the swimming photo, so do check it out. I believe that this leaked swimming photo should have at the very least been honestly investigated. Tangible evidence is the best that can be offered in the face of dismissing it outright. This swimming photo does exist. The Dutch NFI professionals have analysed this photo, they have confirmed in writing. And they also have confirmed its authenticity. They say it is not a photoshop photo. They just do not believe the two women pictured in it are Kris and Lisanne. We don't know who the two women are; no 'lookalikes' ever sought the media or came forward and the NFI never gave any hints about their identity or even nationality either. But this verified photo does show both Murgas and Osman – along with what appear to be to me a very close match to Kris and Lisanne, who happen to be a redhead and a brunette with high cheekbones. I know that many people don't think Kris and Lisanne are in this photo, but I still disagree with that. Even more intriguing is that this photo was taken by someone else from across the river. That in itself is a concerted effort to document this at a time when both those men were still alive, along with these coy women. Is this the photo which locals said for years was found on Osman's phone? Local newspapers reported at the time of Osman's death about his mobile phone having been seized by police and never having been given back to his family, which appears to be true in fact. The media also hinted at photos of two young women looking just like Kris and Lisanne having been found on Osman's phone, possible referring to this swimming photo that was leaked. Did the photographer take this swimming photo in order to try to frame Osman and Murgas? Creating a 'last seen' photo of them with Kris and Lisanne? And where was it taken? Juan and I narrowed the location down to a spot near the Caldera hot springs, identifying the exact location and rocks in the background. That is where the 'Caldera theory' springs from. The photo original is named "Sabroson", possibly linking to the Sabroson restaurant in that area, or to Edwin A. who's family owns the Sabroson restaurant chain. We also do not know yet if and how this Caldera swimming event can be placed in the overall timeline of Kris and Lisanne's comings and goings. But the timeline is a mess anyway. We may have been fed an incorrect one by Miriam and Eileen for all we know. In any case, the swimming photo is discussed in more detail here and a recent 2024 book which covers this photo is also discussed by me there.
This podcast provides so many new and interesting leads and interviews, but fails to mention the swimming photo. As I understand it, the makers are not convinced that this photo is linked to the case. They do not mention it at all, neither to discredit its authenticity. Why didn't the makers present it to Margarita to ask if it are indeed Osman and Murgas pictured? Possibly with the Dutch girls? Ask her whether that photo was found on Osman's phone or not? And was Osman's phone returned to his family? I wish Jeremy and Mariana asked his mother that question. Because if that is Osman (and I am 100% certain it are Osman and Murgas in that photo), then it cannot be true what Ferrara says about Osman only having seen Kris and Lisanne 'once', when seeing them sitting in Henry's red pick up truck at that market square in Boquete... I think that Osman may have been a little bit more involved in all this than what he may have told his mum. Because just spotting the women once in a car in town seems just not enough for Osman to die the way he did. As Power Pixie said: "There had to be more of his involvement in this, and I really believe that due to self-preservation Osman did not mention the Caldera episode to this mother." It seems much more logical that Osman was dragged in way more than that. I think he was present when things went very wrong, and then got very nervous and appeared a liability, hence why he was killed. Unfortunately the Swimming Photo also remains a mystery.
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[Ep. 6] IN THE HOUSE OF THE CROW
This sixth episode focuses on the findings of Martin Ferrara O'Donnell and on a testimony made by the mother of deceased 'Bandida' wannabe Osman Valenzuela. Interestingly, we have not heard this mother Margarita Valenzuela (69) being interviewed by the western press yet. Although she did tell local Panamanian newspapers shortly after her son's death on April 4th of 2014, how anxious and paranoid her son had behaved in the days leading up to his unnatural death at age 22. The podcast makers say that she was first 'reluctant to talk', but then agreed to meet them in a hotel anyway. "She doesn't seem afraid. She is angry that the police hasn't brought her son's killers to justice". And she is said to be angry that all the podcast makers can offer her is to talk to her, because 'talking won't keep her safe'. She sounds disillusioned and tired of waiting for some judicial action that never comes. Margarita says that since her son died (was murdered), she herself has been threatened. And that she fears for her safety and the safety of her other children. 'She says that the people who did this are the same group of young men, the same 'Bandida', that Kryt and Atencio have been investigating'. They live in the same town and she feels she has nowhere else to go. She says that these members of the Bandida even crashed the Rosary held for her son. [Scarlet: This is information which has been circulating for years already, and I wrote about it in part 2 some years ago already]. During the Rosary Edwin sent members over who threw stones at her house. To scare them and warn them not to talk. They also threatened Margarita's daughter, telling her to give her mom the message not to talk about them or the Dutch girls, or else "we wíll kill you". Margarita is very worried about this she says. But nevertheless she now talks openly on record with the podcast makers. In her own words: for the mothers of the deceased Dutch woman and for her son to rest in peace.
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OSMAN'S MOTHER TALKSMargarita says that Osman was basically a good Christian boy, who tried to be part of the wrong crowd. He was good friends with a young woman in town, Milagros P. Margherita says, that’s where all the trouble started. Milagros was also friends with the members of the 'Bandida': Henry, Edwin, Murgas, Cuervo, Sam John and got them into contact. Milagros introduced them to Osman. Osman had already known them from school, but never really fit in before. But Milagros arranged a job for Osman at a local restaurant, where he got to know some of the Bandidas lads better. Osman used to help out Milagros with caring for her young child, so they trusted one another. Margherita: My son was a young man who was very generous, very affectionate, very respectful. He was like that. Maybe because he was so trusting, that’s what happened to him, happened to him. My son wasn’t a bad kid. He liked to go to church, he liked going to dances.
Then the mother shares a very interesting piece of information, which I hadn't seen covered yet in the local media (although I may have simply missed it): Margarita confirms Martin's story how her son's autopsy report initially stated that he died an accidental drowning death. But that this official cause of death was at some point altered by investigators. It was changed in 'the crime of homicide'. Woah.. Margarita says that when she went to see her son in the morgue, she asked the man who did the autopsy: "Why has my son marks on his wrists and on his legs?" The coroner didn't know. Jeremy Kryt details in the Aftershow of the podcast however that there was nothing in the autopsy report that indicates marks on wrists and legs. Margarita also also noticed bruises on Osman's body that weren't mentioned in the autopsy report. Jeremy Kryt says later that the bruising was on the outside of Osman's right knee and was seen on a small area of skin: within a 7 by 8 centimeter circumference. But he also brings up that post mortem, different skin discolorations can take place. Osman had also suffered a (non-lethal) hemorrhagic contusion on the back of his head. He had been hit in the head, hard. This is also in the autopsy report. 'The logical conclusion was that he had been smacked from behind and then dumped in the river to drown while unconscious. Water in his lungs means he was alive when he entered the river'. But despite authorities ruling Osman's death a murder, no arrests were ever made.
The initial 'accidental drowning' verdict was changed into 'the crime of homicide'. Osman had marks on his wrists and legs and bruises on his body. Osman had also suffered a hemorrhagic contusion on the back of his head. But despite authorities ruling Osman's death a murder, no arrests were ever made.
Margarita tells Kryt and Atencio that she has 'known for years who killed her son'.
It were the guys from the local Bandida. The same ones who threw stones at her house during her son's Rosary and who threatened her and her children. Margarita Valenzuela now starts to explain why these Bandida lads were bad news. They sold cocaine and marijuana. Drugs. They wielded power. 'Tito' went to the same high school as Osman, she says, and already was 'a very problematic boy' back then. The leader of the Bandida however is not Henry, but Edwin 'Sabroson'. Edwin has another nickname, Margarita says: El Pulpo: the octopus. 'He manages the whole group and is the one who distributes. He is the ringleader of everything that is sold and distributed'. And it was his red pickup truck that played a role in the disappearance of Kris and Lisanne. According to Margarita, Osman told her shortly after the disappearance of Kris and Lisanne that he had something important to tell her. He told her that he was having some trouble with the young men in the Bandida. "He tells me: 'Mom, they are telling me they're going to kill me'. So I ask him: 'why?' And he tells me: 'Because I saw the Dutch girls in the car." Osman saw them on Boquete's town square, the day before their disappearance. He saw Edwin's red pickup truck parked there. "In the rear seat of the car he saw the Dutch girls. Each had a beer in their hands and they were smoking cigarettes. He didn't talk to them, he just saw them." Then after Kris and Lisanne disappeared, his friend Milagros told Osman that she knew they were dead. And that the Bandida was responsible. Margarita claims that Milagros also told Osman exactly what they did to the Dutch girls.
"Because I saw them with the Dutch girls, they are going to kill me."
Hidden bombshell: "The police report does indeed mention that Murgas was the last person to have seen Osman alive. The witnesses included Henry 'Tito' G. and Edwin 'Sabroson' A. and their respective girlfriends at the time...
MURGAS' STATEMENTS
But Murgas could also tell Margarita what had happened to Kris and Lisanne. Because he was present there as well. He and the Bandida (minus Sam John D, seen on the right, if we have to believe Murgas and who works at this pizzeria at the bottom of the Pianista according to Marianna) followed Kris and Lisanne up the Pianista in a red pickup truck. Then they took them along in the jungle on foot. The Bandida knew where to find them, since Kris and Lisanne had taken a taxi to the Pianista trailhead. "And as the taxi was driving down, Murgas along with Edwin, Tito and Cuervo were in the red pickup truck, driving up." Margarita: "They then stopped the taxi driver, asking him where he left the Dutch girls". Police interviewed this taxi driver twice (Leonardo), but he never mentioned running into the Bandida when driving back into town. 'He also changed his story and the date and time when he dropped off the Dutch girls.' But initially he didn't want to talk, unless there was security. "Because I know if I talk, they will kill me". Leonardo drowned a few weeks before Murgas was killed. Murgas had also told Margarita that Kris and Lisanne were surprised to run into the Bandida on the Pianista trail. And also a bit afraid, because they had not planned to meet those guys up there. But ultimately they followed the Bandida back to town. But they tricked them, telling the girls that they would show them the Piedra de Lino trail. The scenic overlook near the Pianista. But instead, they walked towards Palo Alto according to Margarita, to Cuervo's house. A place where Kris and Lisanne had partied before, according to Murgas. This time they gave Kris and Lisanne alcohol and drugs. And then things went downhill. Margarita: "They were happy and then suddenly, under the spell of euphoria, these men went crazy. And they started grabbing the girls, and the girls didn't want to do anything". Tito started touching Kris, and 'Kris struggled, tried to shake him off'. "Then she hit him in the face. Because she didn't want him to rape her. And that's when the boy hit her". Tito completely lost it. "When he hits her he knocks her off and throws her to the ground. And when she fell, he began to hit her, and hit her. Murgas said that he hit her with his fists. In the face. And the other young woman sees what they are going to do and she screams. But in that house, who is going to hear her? There is no one around. So that young woman died instantly from all the blows those men gave her. And her friend sees that. She threw herself on top of the other one, and the same thing happened to her. That was when they hit the second one with a hammer. Well, that's how they got the other one in the same way. She was so disfigured. Then they all raped her. It was like a massacre. There was a pool of blood." [Photo of Sam John D. on his own facebook page and a picture of him standing on the right with Henry, posted in 2012 on Henry's FB page]When the Bandidas got to their senses, they realized they had to cover it up somehow. Cuervo called one of his employees, a Ngäbe-Buglé man from Alto Romero, to come and clean up the crime scene. He was the one to clean Cuervo's house. The young men then dismembered the bodies according to Margarita, before burying the remains in black trash bags on Cuervo's property. Near a mango tree, according to Murgas. According to Margarita. Then, after a couple of weeks, the men decide to 'scatter some strategic remains in the jungle. To make it look like a hiking accident.' "They cut her foot with this hack saw and from there, that leg, they throw it on the waters of the river. Why did they do it? To throw people off the trail of where they could have been." In the Aftershow Jeremy Kryt states that Margarita also gave another chilling detail: that the alleged perpetrators poured kerosene on the remains, to speed up decomposition. We know that the rib bone of Kris indeed showed signs of bleaching. The forensic anthropologist who did the autopsy of Kris and Lisanne's remains was asked about the kerosene element, and confirmed that "that would work very well to bleach that bone". Kryt: "Multiple members of the national forensics team in Panama had suggested that a caustic substance had been put on the remains, and that could account for the bleaching. They had speculated perhaps lime, but the gentleman we spoke to and interviewed said that kerosene would actually work faster than lime to result in bone bleaching." So that is an interesting detail.
Tito started touching Kris, and Kris struggled, tried to shake him off. "Then she hits him in the face. Because she didn't want him to rape her. And that's when the boy hits her"
Osman's mother, Margarita, also claims that Jose Murgas told her that the gang had faked the phone activity, staged the Camera photographs, as well as scattered the remains along the river. [Scarlet: If true, then I wonder if they got some help with that... By adults with the outdoors experience and the intelligence to be able to stage most of these events, and make a convincing scenario for the two Dutch tourists simply took walk and were the authors of their own misfortune. If true, they're not just obscuring what actually happened, but are trying to set investigators on a wild goose chase]. Margarita believes that the emergency calls and the night photos were also staged. Kris and Lisanne didn't make them. The young lads confiscated the phones and made those emergency calls themselves. They would have certainly known how far they would have to walk from Cuervo's house in order to strategically lose reception. Making it look like Kris and Lisanne were lost in the jungle. Margarita says that Henry said that he knew what he was doing. And it was Edwin who took the night photos, according to Margarita. "He said: To throw people off the trail". And missing photo 509 was deleted because it showed Henry and Edwin. And this, could have implicated them. The perfect crime, as long as nobody would talk. And the people who seemed to be the weakest links were taken out... [Scarlet: Although I would still not rule out the theory that the authorities themselves could have even staged things, to make it look like an accident and to cover up the political damage which would be caused by the truth. Nobody can in all seriousness deny there is corruption in Panama. But I would love to have heard from Margarita how exactly that photo #509 was deleted so thoroughly? Since we know that simply pressing 'delete' was not going to permanently get rid of the photo. So how did they permanently remove that photo? And was it planned? Unfortunately we hear nothing about this from Margarita].
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Margarita told Murgas that he had to make a statement to a lawyer, but that Murgas was afraid that he would end up dead, like Osman. Murgas had talked to the cops, Kryt and Atencio confirm, based on the police files. She comforted him that he wasn't going to get killed [Scarlet: based on what? Didn't we just hear how easy and quick Osman was eliminated?] and had to come clean. And suddenly Murgas agreed with Margarita, she says [huh?]. But before he had a chance to talk to the authorities, he went to a canteen on his 22nd birthday and got drunk. Guess who was there? Milagros, the black widow. As well as Henry and Edwin. 'And they took him'. Because drunk Murgas had suddenly forgotten about his death fear and 'started to make very public confessions in the cantina, right there and then. Stating loudly how they had all killed Kris and Lisanne.' 'And Osman'. [Scarlet: bizarre behaviour that is, for a youth fearing for his life if he ever talks. Why go secretly to a lawyer with Margarita when you can also shout it out in public with Henry and Edwin and Milagros present...?]. The Bandida quietly disappeared with a drunk Murgas, Margarita then says and drove away. He was found dead by the roadside the next morning, in a seeming hit and run. But in fact, he was purposely run over multiple times by Henry and Edwin.
"There is also a back road leading from the Pianista trail to this Palo Alto area. It's called Pata de Macho. [..] Even the bigger reveal is that when we sent our head guide up the Pianista to find the mouth of the Pata de Macho trail, he was told by multiple sources on the mountain that guide F. had ordered that trail to be closed."
PATA DE MACHO TRAIL AND CUERVO'S HOUSEKryt and Atencio go out with Jose to explore the Palo Alto area and drive to The Crow, Cuervo's, house. The place with the mango tree. "Not thirty metres from a hotel". They do multiple drive by's in fact. 'The House' is described as a relatively small, one story building. Painted in a sickly shade of orange-yellow. There is a dog on the porch, the front door is ajar, a television plays inside. It does seem that Jeremy and company are aware there may be someone in the house. While they are stood on the door of the (empty?) house, one of the crew spots a mango tree on the other side of a fence, at the rear of this house. They sneak around. The tree is in or by a small creek, along with other small trees and shrubs. You can actually hear the breeze and water bubbling as Jeremy speaks while evaluating this space. This place is rather concealed, Kryt says, and indeed has no cell reception within a hundred meters, the podcast makers confirm: "Within about a hundred yards of the Property, headed into the jungle, there is no cell reception." Pondering a hidden, secret trail Jeremy speculates that "There may be a trail that connects this house, or the grounds behind the house, with the Pianista trail." - In the Aftershow of episode 6, Kryt describes the house and its surroundings as "A residential neighborhood. The road switches from pavement to gravel, just about 100 metres north of the Palo Alto neighborhood. There are plots of farmland sprinkled about. There áre houses nearby, and those houses were there in 2014. Certainly within earshot. In the vicinity. If they were calling for help, someone would have heard them. We've also been told it is a party house where there were commonly parties, so loud music or people shrieking with laughter.. the neighbours could have become accustomed to that. So they maybe didn't respond or didn't bat an eye. And from Margarita's description, based on what Murgas told her, Kris was killed very quickly, But she does talk about how Lisanne began to scream. So that made me wonder." Mariana adds that this is a rural place, and that she doesn't know really if people live there all year round. Jeremy: "There's a hotel not 30 meters away." And when they are on the Pate de Macho trail, Jeremy states that Cuervo's house is "about two kilometres down the hill". [Scarlet: This seems to roughly align with the area to the north of the Tree Trek Adventure park].
"He actually threatened the landowner to get him to close that trail down, according to sources on the mountain."
There is also a back road leading from the Pianista trail to this Palo Alto area. It's called Pata de Macho ('hoof of the tapir'). Interesting.. I long assumed there were other, unkempt and small trails leading away from the Pianista trail. Trails which could have been used to kidnap Kris and Lisanne, without them being seen. But this is a very interesting bit of information on at least one such a path, confirmed by Kryt and Martin who saw the trail and its linking to the Pianista with their own eyes. Mariana rightly makes it clear that this discovery is a *huge* deal and it really shouldn't be downplayed. Discovering the (back)trail that connects the Paolo Alto house to the Pianista should probably be a turning point for everyone. This route could have certainly been used to move people or remains around unseen. Jose Donderis: "It's not a trail, it's a path. If you pass by it today and if tomorrow you want to pass by it again, and it has rained, you probably won't be able to get through unless you cut the undergrowth with a machete." The Pata de Macho path is not used a lot, the podcast makers describe. It's flatter, longer, less strenuous and pretty empty. Only park rangers and possibly hunters [and local tour guides of course] still use it. It's also overgrown and hard to spot and it takes almost twice as long to lead to the Mirador than the Pianista does; between three and five hours. [Scarlet: So it takes 3 to 5 hours to climb this Pata de Macho trail, from Palo Alto up to the Mirador. Kris and Lisanne are said to have been led down the other way, so downwards, which would have taken less time logically speaking. So if Kris, Lisanne and their company had started marching after 14.00 PM, they could have either still been walking down this trail by the time the first two emergency calls were made, or they could have already been at Cuervo's house by then.] Jose Donderis, the former head of Sinaproc, confirms that this Pata de Macho route was NOT or barely searched. "Because we were prohibited". "We had problems with the authorities. The director of the operation was not comfortable with my participation on the site, due to political problems."
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This last podcast episode from Lost in Panama continues on the path from episode 6. Kryt and Atencio look for supporting witnesses, to back up Margarita Valenzuela's bold claims. Martin Ferrara O'Donnell is still mentioned at times, most likely because Margarita's theory is closely linked to Martin's theory, which he investigated and made a file about over the years. First Kryt and Atencio look for some balance and talk to one (single) forensic criminologist specialist from Australia, Dr. Claire Ferguson, who is specialised in homicide staging. When asked to look into the Bandidas theory, she says that staging elements in a crime scenario is by itself nothing new. Offenders often pretend to be the victim on their mobile phones for instance, to obscure the actual timeline for investigators. [We saw a similar thing in the case of Frauke Liebs for instance, with very advanced, complicated staging events and manipulation of electronic data - a case which Ferguson may know nothing about]. But in this Kris and Lisanne case, Dr. Claire Ferguson considers it highly unlikely (read: a mastermind move) that staging happens before a crime occurs. Staging happens more often after a crime has taken place, when the perpetrators come to their senses and start to scramble for control. But premeditation to the point of staging fake calls before the murders took place, is not likely according to her. Scarlet: A weak comment from Ferguson is in my view how she deduces that it is unlikely that the calls were staged, because the first two emergency calls made between roughly 16:30 and 17:00 PM on Tuesday the 1st of April would leave too little time between the moment of photo 508 (when we know Kris and Lisanne were still OK) and the moment the perpetrators were done with their kidnapping, abuse and killing and starting to use the victims' phones to stage a fake trail. HOWEVER, I do not hear the dr. suggest that these initial two calls could have been actually made by Kris and Lisanne, secretively. In the midst of whatever horrors happened to them. I lean heavily to this anyway as these Bandida kids are unlikely to have known or researched in advance which emergency number the Netherlands has. But they could still have seized the phones and used them during the next days to replicate those initial emergency calls (for continuity, for a fake trail) and added 911 emergency calls to the list, made in a zone without reception. I wished Ferguson would have looked into that much more likely scenario as well. Dr. Claire Ferguson also says that it happens more often that perpetrators hide a body entirely, as opposed to digging parts back up to place them somewhere to be found. Of course, statistics brings you only so far and means nothing for all those people hit by buses and killed by strangers every day on this planet. Statistically it's rare, but what do you buy for this when it happens to you anyway? So I am personally not very hung up on statistical chance explanations. We can only say really that it would take an intelligent and shrewd person to place Lisanne's left leg bones and Kris' pelvis and rib bone out there near Alto Romero, in an attempt to further stage a Lost/Accident scenario. And possibly ask for the high reward money from the Dutch families. (There were both the means and the motive here). Is it likely? Statistically it is more likely for perpetrators to make those bodies go away entirely, never to be seen again. But is it impossible? Of course it isn't. Has it ever happened before in a comparable way? It has. So well..
LOOKING FOR WITNESSES
Kryt and Atencio move on and try to find witnesses who can corroborate Margarita's story. They try to speak with the indigenous man who Cesar 'La Cuervo' S. is believed to have called to help clean up the bloodbath, and who is also reported to have helped to dig the graves. Of course, if true, this guy is one of the very few living witnesses remaining. And it is no surprise that the man is hesitant to talk to the foreign podcast makers. They make an attempt though, with the help of locals such as their guide. In good Boquete fashion, this guide 'heard rumours' from his sister in law, who heard from hér nephew how the native man who helped Cuervo confessed to his aunt that he had seen a table full of blood in the house he was called upon to clean. And that's all the guide knows. Another local, owning a ranch, says to know more and tells the podcast makers that... he doesn't want to talk about it. 'Because the Bandida have already killed plenty of people in town'. But then he starts talking anyway. "One of them was Osman. That guy was one of the good ones. And any time there was a party, he was there. And that guy, they killed him. They hit him with a rock. The taxi driver, they drowned him. The last person they killed, who was a friend of theirs, they passed the car over him forward and backwards, forward and backwards. Many times, and hello and goodbye. He died and that was it. It was a guy they called Murgas." So his identity is concealed by the podcast makers. Because if the Bandida finds out [and they will, considering the global reach of this public podcast] they may threaten his kids or grandchildren, and then this man will háve to kill thém... Understandably. "I would have to kill all of Henry's family". There we have that lad again. "Henry is a friend of mine. Well.. I know him, yes. He's a horrible person. He's crazy. He's a violent person. Edwin is demented. That guy is rotten. That man is damaged. He is always on drugs".
"One of them was Osman. And that guy, they killed him. They hit him with a rock. The taxi driver, they drowned him. The last person they killed, who was a friend of theirs, they passed the car over him forward and backwards, forward and backwards. He died and that was it. It was a guy they called Murgas."
Then he sums up all the people who were involved in the deaths of Kris and Lisanne [but we don't hear how he knows this with any certainty, or whether this is hearsay or if he has firsthand information]. "Henry. The Sabroson. A guy who is dark skinned and very tall, they call him Sam John." Cesar Cuervo was not involved, he says. Then he echoes the story of Margarita: these guys kidnapped and murdered Kris and Lisanne. But NOT at the house of Cuervo in Palo Alto. But instead they killed them in guide F's finca in the jungle. "In one of the houses they have around here, in [inaudible, something like Jaramillo], they had those girls. They supposedly killed the girls the second or the third day they had them. That stuff about Palo Alto is a lie. They were never in Palo Alto. These women had nothing to do with Pata de macho". "They say those guys went crazy over the girls. I imagine it was Henry, because Henry is the craziest of them all. Henry and the Sabroson. They killed one then the other and cut them into pieces. They say they had them in black bags. And after killing them, to piece them up and put them in bags. Only crazy people do that." [Scarlet: The thing is: this story sounds like the one of Margarita, and Martin. But does that mean it is the truth? Or simply that everybody believes the same spread narrative?] The man continues: "When the indigenous man enters, he sees blood all over the floor. And when he sees blood, he asks: this is from a hunt. From where? Where's the meat? All of a sudden he sees the bag, and he opens it and that's when he finds the head of one of the girls. When he does that, obviously he is shocked. Henry tells him: if you talk, we kill you too." So that sounds like the sort of threat you'd better respect. But the Ngäbe-Buglé man cannot resist temptation, and talks to his sister about the grizzly discovery anyway. "He comes to his sister scared and tells his sister what happened. He tells his sister that they're gonna kill him if he says anything. But his sister didn't keep it under wraps. Se told some of her colleagues." And from there it spread and that's how he found out. He even knows the identity of the Ngäbe-Buglé man. Of course Mariana Atencio really wants to meet this man, and the local guide she is talking to suggests the only logical option available: "You've got to kidnap him".😄"You've got to extract him, get him out of there!" Of course, the Boquete way..
[Scarlet: No matter how much I personally believe that the truth lies in this very detailed rumour, I cannot stop wondering why the indigenous man, employed by one of the Bandidas, would risk his livelihood and actual life by chatting to his sister. Who of course spread the rumour further. The whole train of rumour does throw some doubt on the narrative, because 'Radio Platane' is known to embellish stories at every next stop. It doesn't make this story more believable therefore, knowing it is a rumour everybody in Boquete reportedly knows about, but nobody in the press wrote about explicitly. Nor investigated properly. Although that last one is really no surprise. It seems obvious to me that Betzaida Pittí ignored all of this. Like she did with every homicide lead in this case. She must be among the worst and most corrupt prosecutors and 'case solvers' in the history of Boquete and surroundings. Oh dear, am I Pittí-bashing again? I don't care].
'Why are you asking about this case when the case is closed?', guide F. said to the agents.
TRYING TO GET THE NGÄBE-BUGLÉ MAN TO TALKSo anyway, the ONLY actual witness of this massacre, reportedly, the Ngäbe-Buglé man who works for Cuervo, is of course scared to talk. He finally gives in by the sound of it and agrees to meet Kryt and Atencio the next day in town, but is a no-show. Probably for the best, or else we could have another murder in Boquete. In their hunt for this man, the podcast makers do talk to another Ngäbe-Buglé man, a local guide called Balbino Salmudio. He worked in 2014 as a guide for the Panamanian justice department. Back in 2014, the justice department already tried to interview this Ngäbe-Buglé 'witness'. "The head of the justice department sent Balbino with two agents to interrogate this specific Ngäbe-Buglé man. They found him at guide F's farm. Guide F. showed up during the interrogation. He was very angry. At first he thought they were just regular citizens and his temper was on full display. But then he saw their badges, and toned it down a bit. 'Why are you asking about this case when the case is closed?', guide F. said to the agents. He wanted to cut short the interview and interrogation with X." And guide F. was successful, stopped the interview and sent the agents off his land. "He is a very smart man. I can't exactly say he is dangerous, but there is something about him. He thinks X knows something of which guide F. doesn't want him to talk."
"The community knows about this information. That the Dutch girls were at a party in the area of Palo Alto in a house. A cabin in a precarious condition. A cabin, well not a nice one. And that at the cabin there was consumption of alcohol and consumption of drugs." - A case official
A CASE OFFICIAL SPILLS THE BEANS
Nevertheless, Kryt and Atencio find out more about all this through an interview with a case official from the Kris and Lisanne case. A detective who worked on the official Kris and Lisanne case at the time. He remains anonymous and says that he is agreeing to be interviewed because he is close to his retirement and wants justice for Kris and Lisanne. The case continues to eat at him. "The community knows about this information. That the Dutch girls were at a party in the area of Palo Alto in a house. A cabin in a precarious condition. A cabin, well not a nice one. And that at the cabin there was consumption of alcohol and consumption of drugs." The Boquete police knew about this party in 2014... The detective says that an informant approached police back in 2014 with details about the party. Who was there, and what went down. "Certain things got out of hand with the people who were at that party with the Dutch girls. The missing girls. And certain things happened which resulted in deaths. Sex, drugs, music; that's the information that was circling around. Names were mentioned such as Sabroson, Sam John, Murgas, the son of guide F., who was a tour guide. And he was even the same tour guide who was going to take the Dutch girls to the places they agreed on." There are the same names again, now mentioned by the police officer who worked on this very case.
And most interestingly: this information was submitted to the prosecutor's office and ended up in the case report. But not for long. "The investigator and another person prepared a report and submitted it to the public ministry. They mentioned these names. These names, mentioned places, mentioned dates, mentioned events of how the party actually took place." But the report is no longer there in the case files. "They [the prosecutor's office] were unsatisfied with the report, because it went against the main line of investigation. Well, what happened to it? That's a good question. It would be interesting to investigate if that report was incorporated into a larger file. I haven't had access to the report, it's with the prosecutor in charge." Well well, surprise surprise: this detailed report about the party was never further pursued by Pitti and her team. Just placed at the bottom of some big stack of files. In a backroom. Never to be seen again. Case closed.
"They [the prosecutor's office] were unsatisfied with the report, because it went against the main line of investigation. Well, what happened to it? That's a good question."
PITTÍ IS BACK
The only thing the podcast makers find in the case files, is that an anonymous informant mentioned the name of Murgas to police in October of 2014. Stating that Jose Manuel Murgas 'may have important information in this case'. The cops did follow up on this, according to the case files, but Murgas did not confess to them and denied being present at any murder. Not the murders of Kris and Lisanne and not the murder of Osman Valenzuela. He even denied having ever met Kris and Lisanne. 'But he did cast suspicion on the members of the Bandida, especially 'Tito'. He said a group of guys in town, Tito, Edwin and Sam John, might have something to do with their deaths'. In the official case report: "He [Murgas] added that at the time the girls disappeared, Henry told him what the problem was. That they were lost and he had been the last one who had seen them. According to the interviewee, he did not see Henry in the area until about six days later. And when he asked him where he had been, Henry told him that he had gone to his fathers farm in Culebra, to go for a walk. And when he asked him where he went for a walk, Henry changed the subject." [Don't expect any cell phones or computers to have been inspected by police, to find out what father and son had been up to exactly]. At the very end of the report, the anonymous informant gives a detailed description of the red pickup truck with a double cabin and shiny silver rims and tinted windows, in which Edwin had been seen driving around town. That's all that ended up in the final case files. And the cherry on top of all this?
When Kryt and Atencio contacted our heroine, Betzaida Pittí Cerrud for commentary, she said that the only way she will say anything, is if she gets PAID for it. What a woman.... really admirable how she first ruined the investigation, then censored unwanted witness statements from the case files, then gaslit the families, then made good bucks out of a shitty book of lies filled with the case files she illegally traded off despite being fired from the job since 2015, then painted herself as the victim because she had to crawl up some minor hill on all fours as she wasn't fit for purpose. And now this incredible woman only wants to elaborate on her Judas work if she gets paid for it. Kudos to Pittí 💜👆 Oh and Henry himself also has a short (indirect) cameo when Jeremy Kryt goes into a Boquete bar one day and finds himself sitting next to our antagonist at the bar. He claims that he struck up a conversation with him. Kryt tries to charter Henry for an interview, but Henry ghosts them all in the end. But not before confidently boasting in the bar, while raising both his fists in the air, one at a time:
"With this left hand I put my victims in the hospital, and with my right hand I put them in the graveyard".
SO....So at the end of this podcast series, we can state that basically, the only known witness who wasn't directly involved in the 'murders', the Ngäbe-Buglé man called in by Cuervos, needs to talk. And maybe that will reopen the case. But he understandably does not. Too risky perhaps. And so we know a lot of details about the main rumour in Boquete at the end of this podcast series. Finally. But we lack the hard evidence to determine if it covers the truth or not. Although for me personally, these accounts are very, very convincing. Since Margarita was given an abundance of details (many of which can in fact be verified). Given by the two young men who both ended up dead. Murdered. They spoke to her at a time when death was chasing them. That lends weight to their recounts. I believe that this is in fact what happened to Kris and Lisanne. Unfortunately. This podcast and the informants who were allowed to speak in it, have laid out the pieces pretty explicitly and clearly. It is down to the Panamanian authorities to reopen the case (small chance) or down to others to gather and present more information perhaps, in the near future. As Kryt and Atencio conclude in their last Aftershow: these suspects should be investigated. "A proper investigation was never licensed by the DA. And so police had their hands tied".
I agree. As Power-Pixie says: "I have to say, once you do listen to the final episode and its after show that some credit and sympathy needs to go towards the police who did actually try but were prevented from doing so by Pitti." The authorities need to (re)investigate this case properly and responsibly, starting with the foul play narrative presented here by Jeremy Kryt and Mariana Atencio. No more bungling and corrupt district attorneys on this case. But Kryt also suggests that a thorough search of the rivers should be done, to also identify the location of the night photos and the potential places where Kris and Lisanne may have become immobilized.. If we also allow ourselves to focus on a hiking accident scenario. It would be fantastic if one day the location of the night photos would be found. As that may shed more light on who took those photos and why.
I also feel that this podcast and all the global attention it receives could put extra pressure on the Usual Suspects in Boquete. Especially since Kryt and Mariana say in their last After show that they plan to come back to Boquete to dig some more, So far their sources have been simply amazing. I do hope certain people are going to feel the heat and the pressure and that more will speak up. As Dave M. put it: Look at it this way. *If* Margarita's story and the Podcast are more or less right in their testimony, then this bunch have been 'hiding' in plain sight all this time and got away with Murder. Because all this time, all eyes were (wrongly) on guide F's June narrative of Lost/Accident at the cable bridge. "What happens in Boquete stays in Boquete." is a great motto for the movies and for wannabe gangsta's. but in the world of today, gossip gets out eventually. Martin Ferrera is a key player in all this as he had ties with Jeremy Kryt. And Ferrera knew Osman's mother and had drawn information from her that he passed on to Kryt. Meanwhile former prosecutor Pittí sold off her own warped story and manipulations and the perpetrators had eight years of hiding in plain sight, with no one of true power challenging this status quo.
But Jeremy Kryt came back, and this time he means real business, says Dave M. He has come prepared and he is going to all the right places and people. This is something none of them (guide F. nor the gang) have any power over, and no response to either. All they can do is watch on as Kryt bolts around town and begins unravelling the story, together with Mariana and Ferrara. And give another suspiciously timed woe-is-me interview with the Dutch press, in guide F's case. As Kryt arrives at Cesar's house, you have to wonder whether Cesar is in there himself, cowering helplessly as a cameraman and crew stand on his porch and are sniffing at the side of his house. And there isn't anything he can do, except stay out of sight and pretend he isn't there... I wouldn't be surprised if guide F. is increasingly haunted by Kris and Lisanne. If Kris and Lisanne have any powers at this point, I hope they haunt the people involved in an Amityville manner. People involved must have thought it was all over by 2015. But everyone or anyone involved is going to feel this same burden as the years continue to roll by, because this is a story and a disappearance case that is not going back to sleep. In a way, nothing definitive has happened so far. But at the same time everything has happened, as Kryt has just signalled to the World a convincing version of events, backed by intriguing sources, that begs for an international response. Don't be fooled by the silence on certain biased, small scale online platforms. People have picked up on this new, unnerving evidence that Kryt has presented here. How many curious investigators will from now on start to pick up on his work? Come to Boquete themselves to further explore and unravel the story he tells? And I don't mean those few Dutch TV makers who unimaginatively stuck to Pitti's lies. I mean people who will want to investigate this Pata de Macho trail, who want to tie it to Palo Alto and who want to probe the people said to be involved. Or their friends, girlfriends, ex-partners. Most of Alto Romero. And after nearly nine years, it is going to be hard to keep all of these potential voices silent. Cuervo and Edwin both have family reputations and business to maintain. And there's a good chance that this will go on and on... because this case has developed a life of its own and it fascinates people the world over. And the more this drags on, the more Panama *could* finally decide that a line has to be drawn under the whole thing and that some names and faces have to be sacrificed. For the sake of Panama's tourism appeal and Boquete's fine reputation... Well, one can always hope. - Well said Dave!
I think that it is fair to say that everyone is waiting for more facts. Because based on what the case officials did unearth, no sleuth can prove what exactly happened. There are too many facts and details missing. But with an investigation as sloppy and shaky as the one from Pittí, and the dozens and dozens of open questions in this case, it is inevitable that suspicions and unofficial research will go in all directions. Because so few actual facts have been unearthed or made public in this case, and so many bewildering details remain unexplained. It is ultimately the responsibility of law enforcers and official investigators to act professionally and solve matters. But instead, the official people have closed this case firmly and are not interested in a reopening it. And that should anger each and everyone of us. I am happy with every private initiative that is set up to go out there and actively dig further in this case. Hopefully, bit by bit, the fog will clear.
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Summary of the podcasts Main Findings + thoughts and questions (scroll down for latest updates)
-Martina who lives on the Pianista trail told Jeremy Kryt and Mariana Atencio that guide guide F. essentially told her right after the girls got lost to shut up about this case and not talk to anyone about the fact that she had seen the Dutch girls. He threatened her with jail time 'for telling the truth'.-The case files detail a statement from guide F., in which he declares that on April 1st he got a phone call from one of the language school's employees to make a last minute appointment for Kris and Lisanne to tour a local farm. Guide F. disclosed that he had earlier that day seen Kris and Lisanne at this language school. "Just a 'Hello' from afar. That was all." So despite his varying statements in the press, he confirmed to police that he hád in fact seen Kris and Lisanne in person on Tuesday April 1st, at the school. Is it odd that nobody ever questioned him about this? What was he doing there, since he had no appointment at that stage? Why was this detail almost completely omitted from all reporting and subsequent research into the case? How is it then that we knew all about how he and Eileen went to Miriam's house etc, but knew absolutely nothing about what he said to the Police (very early on, when his memory was fresh) about his school visit that morning, and the afternoon phone call for a tour booking? He himself claimed in the media that he was in David in hospital that day, so how does this combine? And was he really in David back then (did Pittí ever verify his phone data that day? I think not), or was this a smokescreen of sorts?
-Guide F. also stated to police: "They call me to tell me the two young women I had seen at the school wanted to go to Mister Filo's Farm (?) in Alto Quiel. I didn't have any commitments the next day, so I told her I'd pick them up at 8 o'clock in the morning at the school. That's what we agreed on." Why have we never before heard about "Mr Filo's farm in Alto Quiel"? Is this a strawberry or coffee farm perhaps? And what's with this ' tagging along' of Eileen? I still have no idea where Eileen believed she could get the free time from to come along on guided tours, given there was effectively nobody present at Spanish by the River as a result on Wednesday. All other staff were also gone. Ingrid and Marjolein were in Costa Rica at that point. And Eileen was given the responsibility to run the joint. She had been absent on Monday as well at times. The girl only arrived in Boquete two days prior, what sort of internship was this really? Eileen was boarding at the school, responsible for opening up and being at the front desk as far as we know, but was she so poor an employee that she struggled to complete a full days work...?
-Guide F. also stated to police: "They call me to tell me the two young women I had seen at the school wanted to go to Mister Filo's Farm (?) in Alto Quiel. I didn't have any commitments the next day, so I told her I'd pick them up at 8 o'clock in the morning at the school. That's what we agreed on." Why have we never before heard about "Mr Filo's farm in Alto Quiel"? Is this a strawberry or coffee farm perhaps? And what's with this ' tagging along' of Eileen? I still have no idea where Eileen believed she could get the free time from to come along on guided tours, given there was effectively nobody present at Spanish by the River as a result on Wednesday. All other staff were also gone. Ingrid and Marjolein were in Costa Rica at that point. And Eileen was given the responsibility to run the joint. She had been absent on Monday as well at times. The girl only arrived in Boquete two days prior, what sort of internship was this really? Eileen was boarding at the school, responsible for opening up and being at the front desk as far as we know, but was she so poor an employee that she struggled to complete a full days work...?
-The podcast makers then detail police case information stating that guide F. and Eileen then headed towards Miriam's place. Miriam Guerra is said here to be a friend of guide F.. That he knew exactly where they were staying. And that it was a symbiotic business arrangement for all involved. 'Travelers would come to Boquete, study at the language school, sightsee with guide F. and stay at his friend's house down the street'. How did guide F. know that Kris and Lisanne were staying at Miriam's place? Considering he only saw and never really spoke with Kris and Lisanne, according to his own statement? Why that sort of knowledge about them? And does this perhaps explain why Miriam allowed him inside her house and inside her guests private room, despite not being present herself? And did guide F. perhaps take cables from that room? Necessary to remove photo #509 from the digital camera with the help of a computer, and allowing the Samsung phone to be powered on when Pittí received it months later? (And as Power-Pixie wrote me: "I'm also not convinced that the phones' GPS was turned off by both Kris and Lisanne themselves. That for me is the most important event in the logs as it would have literally created a roadmap of their whereabouts. Yet nothing was recorded for this either").-Guide F. searched the Pianista twice, we are told here. Initially all the way to the Rio Culebra. "He went as far as the Mirador on April 3rd and hours beyond it to the Rio Culebra on April 5th." And found nothing. But didn't we hear in the Answers for Kris video from him and the Kremers family that guide F. went already as far as the paddock, aka the meadow, on Thursday April 3rd?
-Jose Donderis, former national head of Sinaproc, claims that Sinaproc just searched the trails, over and over, and did not search the jungle itself. I wished this statement was double checked and verified with other Sinaproc members and volunteer searchers. Donderis also states that in his entire career, he never encountered a situation yet in which not one but two hikers, out together, both had an accident and injury at the same time. And Marcus' statement of hearing women screaming on April 5th was actually reported to Sinaproc. They noted it down, Donderis confirms.
-Locals from Alto Romero were paid by authorities to look for Kris and Lisanne, on their behalf. Tour guide F. was present when several of their remains were found. Nothing was found for 2,5 months, and then suddenly after the backpack was discovered, all sorts of other remains showed up. Laureano Bejerano states that these locals had orders to only search the river. Not anywhere else. Laureano and guide F. were both present when the foot in the boot of Lisanne were found, as well as when the pelvic bone of Kris was found. They were also both present when Kris' denim shorts was found and the blue shoe. Laureano does not want to explain who precisely found these items and where exactly. He says he was warned not to talk to anyone about what he found.
-There were inconsistencies in the testimonies of the workers who discovered the backpack, Irma and Luis. Irma said that she was alone at the river when she found the backpack and went home to show it to her husband, Luis. Whereas Luis has testified that he was right there at the river when Irma saw the bag and took it along. Why don't their stories line up? Irma and Luis also both declared to police that it was the very first time they went to this rice paddy. It says so in the police files. But does that make sense? Who normally worked on that rice paddy then? Why walk at least two hours to go to this specific spot (to wash your clothes?) and what are the odds of ending up exactly where that backpack was supposedly lodged in the river? Seeing it by chance as Irma was doing her thing?
-Police heard about the found backpack due to a phone call from Domingo Gonzalez. Brother of guide F.. Why have case officials and their henchmen so far obscured this detail and incorrectly claimed that a certain 'José D.G.' ("the only person in Alto Romero who possesses a phone") was the one who called the police about the bag's discovery? That appears a shrewd attempt now to conceal the full name and the actual person behind these initials. Or his ties to the tour guide. Why would case officials and their PR team want to keep Domingo Gonzalez' proper name out of the public spheres? And as I have reported on all along, Irma and Luis are indeed employees of guide F. and his family, who own land in the Alto Romero region and employ several of the villagers. Why has this connection also always been kept under wraps in the media and by certain reporters and investigators? Now the idea creeps up that Domingo could theoretically have been involved in telling them what to do and what to say.. Martin Ferrara O'Donnell believes the couple planted the bag there, on instruction of the Gonzalez family. What Atencio and Kryt uncovered here in the Police Files adds such great detail to those guesses - everyone is closely connected with guide F. Whether it be Alto Romero or in Boquete, this man's influence and reach is profound. As Dave M. emphasized: The noteworthy point here is that guide F. is keeping a very deliberate distance in the discovery of the backpack, and appears to have been using proxies. Why would that be?
-Guide Tony adds that guide F. desperately wants to keep this case quiet. And tells everybody in Alto Romero NOT to talk about it anymore, or threatens them not to. Tony was also present when police came to Alto Romero by helicopter and opened the backpack. He saw it and says that despite being wet, the backpack was in "pretty decent shape". It was damaged, but intact. Shouldn't the backpack have fallen apart after months in the river, potentially? Local backpacker George tells the podcast makers that the state of the backpack is 'a huge red flag'. Too convenient how it was found and its state not representing it's supposed long stay out in the elements. It should have completely disintegrated. "Our rainy season, we get 24 to 30 inches a month. So sixty days being out in the rains... heavy rains, I think that was an interesting find. It was too good to be true. And way too late."
-Kryt and Atencio test and confirm that the night photo could not have been shot at the Culebra river or near a monkey bridge.
-It is confirmed again that Betzaida Pitti and her team idiotically altered the images on the original SD card with their photo editing actions [unbelievable...]. She had the original images photoshopped, rotated, brightened and saved this in the original SD card. That is criminal negligence and inexcusable stupidity. Or calculated corruption? What else was permanently changed on that SD card?
-The coroner who personally did the autopsies of their remains, believes until this day that Kris and Lisanne were murdered. He is till this day fearing for his life, he says. But the autopsy reports which he wrote eight years ago, are inconclusive. He was not able to scientifically determine a cause of death for either Kris or Lisanne. Forensic anthropologist and archeologist Dr. Georgina Pacheco agrees that there is not enough information (and that there are not enough remains) available to conclude how they died. No evidence was found in the autopsy report that Lisanne's foot was removed from the tibia bone by force. Pacheco says that the two bones of Kris do not show the same rate of decomposition. The pelvic bone looked normal for the amount of time it had been out there in the jungle. But Kris' rib bone did not. Georgina says that the rib bone had a stark white colour. Almost as if it had been bleached.
-The coroner who personally did the autopsies of their remains, believes until this day that Kris and Lisanne were murdered. He is till this day fearing for his life, he says. But the autopsy reports which he wrote eight years ago, are inconclusive. He was not able to scientifically determine a cause of death for either Kris or Lisanne. Forensic anthropologist and archeologist Dr. Georgina Pacheco agrees that there is not enough information (and that there are not enough remains) available to conclude how they died. No evidence was found in the autopsy report that Lisanne's foot was removed from the tibia bone by force. Pacheco says that the two bones of Kris do not show the same rate of decomposition. The pelvic bone looked normal for the amount of time it had been out there in the jungle. But Kris' rib bone did not. Georgina says that the rib bone had a stark white colour. Almost as if it had been bleached.
-Another local guide who helped with the searches, Verísimo Fuentes claims that guide F.'s son Henry ('Tito') "was with the Dutch girls in the discotheque" on Sunday the 30th of March. And that "many people saw it". Why have we not been presented with other witnesses who saw this? Or confirmation from the people running this discotheque, for instance? What was its name? Why did no other witnesses report this to the police?-Martin Ferrara O'Donnell confirms that 'Tito' can have a foul temper. "He doesn't care about other people's feelings. When he would see a dog in the street, he would get in his car and kill it. He would run them over with his car to kill them." "These are signs of a person who can be considered a psychopath". A local indigenous tour guide also tells the podcast makers: "Henry is a friend of mine. Well.. I know him, yes. He's a horrible person. He's crazy. He's a violent person. Edwin is demented. That guy is rotten. That man is damaged. He is always on drugs". And according to Jeremy Kryt, he meets 'Tito', aka Henry, in person in a bar in Boquete where the inebriated fella boasts to him: "With this left hand I put my victims in the hospital, and with my right hand I put them in the graveyard". Martin also names Tito's friends, La Bandida: "Edwin, Sam John D., Jose Manuel Murgas and Cesar 'La Cuervo' S.". All in their early to mid twenties in 2014. Others confirm these names to belong to the problematic Bandida. Martin claims he has an anonymous informant who knows that Kris and Lisanne bought drugs from this group of friends from 'Tito'. The testimony is recorded on tape. The main theory that buzzes around Boquete, is that Kris and Lisanne ended up at a house party with the Bandida members and that after Kris rejected Tito's advances, he flew in such a rage that he beat her to death. When Lisanne tried to protect her friend, she met the same fate. Is that guide F's motive for being all over this case, trying to steer it in a certain direction? Away from his son?
-Osman Valenzuela's mother tells the podcast makers an even more detailed version of events. Interestingly, we have not heard this mother Margarita Valenzuela (69) being interviewed by the western press yet. Her story overlaps with what Martin Ferrara O'Donnell tells them. On the afternoon of March 31st: Osman Valenzuela "was on Boquete's town square, and saw a double cabin red pickup truck parked there. And he sees mister Edwin 'Sabroson' A. who was driving the car, and mister Sam John D., who is in the passenger seat. In the back of the pickup he sees Henry G. and Jose Manuel Murgas and the two Dutch women sitting in the middle." Osman knew these guys well, and would not have misidentified them. In fact, he wanted to become part of the Bandido, Martin says. "Mister Osman always wanted to belong to the group. He had that wish to be part of the group". With regards to this red pickup truck: someone saw a red pickup truck near the Pianista on the day that Kris and Lisanne went missing. And Martin Ferrara O'Donnell knows who saw the truck. "It was Mrs. Doris. She tells me she sees the women go up. About twenty to twenty-five minutes later, she sees "a red, double cabin pickup truck" go up and then she sees the red pickup truck go down". Doris is the wife of the Il Pianista restaurant owner. Doris does communicate to the podcast makers that indeed, she saw "a red, double cabin pickup truck" go up and then go down again on the Pianista trail. "With oversized tyres and tinted windows". The sister of Martina,(who lives along the Pianista trail and was personally threatened by guide F.), called Anneda (sic) also says that she saw the red pickup truck that day: "I didn't see the Dutch girls, I only heard the sound of the car. I saw a car go up, it was a red pickup truck. I was there when I went to hang up some clothes. I didn't see the girls but my sister says, as soon as she was at the end of the road, that she saw them." 
-Margarita says that since her son died ('was murdered'), she herself has been threatened. And that she fears for her safety and the safety of her other children. 'She says that the people who did this are the same group of young men, the same 'Bandida', that Kryt and Atencio have been investigating'. She says that these members of the Bandida even crashed the Rosary held for her son. During the Rosary Edwin sent members over who threw stones at her house. To scare them and warn them not to talk. They also threatened Margarita's daughter, telling her to give her mom the message not to talk about them or the Dutch girls, or else "we wíll kill you". Margarita says that her good son was betrayed by the kids from the Bandida, but also by a supposed friend called Milagros P. And that the Bandida members killed her son. According to Margarita, Osman told him shortly after the disappearance of Kris and Lisanne that he had something important to tell her. "Mom, they are telling me they're going to kill me'. So I ask him: 'why?' And he tells me: 'Because I saw the Dutch girls in the car." Osman saw them on Boquete's town square, the day before their disappearance. He saw Edwin's red pickup truck parked there. "In the rear seat of the car he saw the Dutch girls. Each had a beer in their hands and they were smoking cigarettes. He didn't talk to them, he just saw them." Then after Kris and Lisanne disappeared, his friend Milagros told Osman that she knew they were dead. And that the Bandida was responsible. Margarita claims that Milagros also told Osman exactly what they did to the Dutch girls. And after that, the threats began. Osman told his mom: "Because I saw them with the Dutch girls, they are going to kill me. And then two days later, they killed my son." -Osman was found dead on April 4th, 2014. The local newspapers reported at the time that Osman was part of the volunteer search group and had on the day of his death even helped look for Kris and Lisanne. Officially it was initially ruled that he drowned and that it was an accident. But Osman's family fought the verdict through a lawyer. Later the police officially changed the manner of death in 'homicide'. Osman's mother confirms this. He had suffered a (non-lethal) hemorrhagic contusion on the back of his head. He had been hit in the head, hard. This is also in the autopsy report. 'The logical conclusion was that he had been smacked from behind and then dumped in the river to drown while unconscious. Water in his lungs means he was alive when he entered the river'. Why was this not splashed all over the (western) news? This seems a rather important detail. Especially since there were official police witness statements made AND documented, that placed Henry and his friends at the scene (!!). No arrests were ever made though. First time we hear about that in the podcast.
-Jose Manuel Murgas talked with Margarita, she claims, shortly before he died. Margarita says that Murgas was 'haunted by guilt'. "I can't sleep, I see your son in my dreams. I can't take it anymore, I need to talk about this. I need you to know the truth". Murgas, according to Osman's mother, confessed to her that Osman was indeed killed by the Bandida. And that Murgas was present, complicit, a witness and also an accomplice. "They killed him because they knew about the Dutch girls". Milagros had invited Osman to go out by the river. She then informed the Bandida that Osman would be there. They followed him to the river and saw Osman sitting on a rock, looking out over the river. That's when the gang attacked. 'Edwin gave the order. he said: "Kill him". Margarita: 'He took up a rock and hit him at the back of the head. My son fell. He wasn't dead, he was still alive. He threw them from a bridge." Jeremy Kryt confirms that the police report indeed mention that Murgas was the last person to have seen Osman alive. Multiple witnesses who were interviewed by the police confirmed that they saw Osman and Murgas go off together, shortly before he died. These witnesses included Henry 'Tito' G. and Edwin 'Sabroson' A. and their respective girlfriends at the time... They were there on site when Osman was killed. They also gave a location where they last saw Osman, but police found that the body of Osman was in fact found upstream from there. Kryt says that the cops were in fact suspicious of that at the time. Again: why has this information not been spread more and why has this not been a chapter at least in the case files of Kris and Lisanne's death? Very interesting how that detail from the actual police report was kept out of Betzaida Pitti's media exercises, as well as out of the media until now. I don't even understand why Kryt and Atencio dropped this in a snippet from the Aftershow, instead of in the regular show.
-Murgas confirmed Martin's story and told Osman's mother also that the Bandida followed Kris and Lisanne up the Pianista in the red pickup truck, after hearing from Leonardo where he had dropped them off and where to find them. Kris and Lisanne were surprised to run into the Bandida on the Pianista trail and also a bit afraid because they had not planned to meet those guys up there. But ultimately followed them back to town. As they tricked them, telling them that they would show them the Piedra de Lino trail. They were taken to Cuervo's house near Palo Alto through a little known or used back trail called Pata de Macho, where drugs and alcohol were consumed. There things escalated, like Martin also detailed before. "They were happy and then suddenly, under the spell of euphoria, these men went crazy. And they started grabbing the girls, and the girls didn't want to do anything". Tito started touching Kris, and 'Kris struggled, tried to shake him off'. "Then she hits him in the face. Because she didn't want him to rape her. And that's when the boy hits her". Tito completely lost it. "When he hits her he knocks her off and throws her to the ground. And when she fell, he began to hit her, and hit her. Murgas said that he hit her with his fists. In the face. And the other young woman sees what they are going to do and she screams. But in that house, who is going to hear her? There is no one around. So that young woman died instantly from all the blows those men gave her. And her friend sees that. She threw herself on top of the other one, and the same thing happened to her. That was when they hit the second one with a hammer. Well, that's how they got the other one in the same way. She was so disfigured. Then they all raped her. It was like a massacre. There was a pool of blood." When the Bandidas got to their senses, they realized they had to cover it up somehow. Cuervo called one of his employees, a Ngäbe-Buglé man from Alto Romero, to come and clean up the crime scene. He was the one to clean Cuervo's house. The young men then dismembered the bodies according to Margarita, before burying the remains in black trash bags on Cuervo's property. Then, after a couple of weeks, the men then decide to 'scatter some strategic remains in the jungle. 'To make it look like a hiking accident.' Margarita claims the alleged perpetrators poured kerosene on the remains, to speed up decomposition. We know that the rib bone of Kris indeed showed signs of bleaching. The forensic anthropologist who did the autopsy of Kris and Lisanne's remains was asked about the kerosene element, and confirmed that "that would work very well to bleach that bone". -But the real breakthrough is the fact that we finally learn about the existence of the Pata de Macho back trail, and about it not having cell reception. I kept this option open all the time, and it was always shot down by others. But there we have it. And there are probably more of those paths, badly maintained, only there for hunters and locals, with machetes. We just never heard any of those Boquete guide about it in the press...
-Margarita claims also that the young lads confiscated the phones of Kris and Lisanne and made the emergency calls themselves. They would have certainly known how far they would have to walk from Cuervo's house in order to strategically lose reception. Making it look like Kris and Lisanne were lost in the jungle. Margarita says that Henry said that he knew what he was doing. And it was Edwin who took the night photos, according to Margarita. "He said: To throw people off the trail". And missing photo 509 was deleted because it showed Henry and Edwin. As Dave M. wrote me aptly: "Out of the 90 images there is one definitive photograph of Kris' hair to suggest that the two are there. When you think on whether these night photos were staged, then the person organising this would absolutely need to get something in there to 'show' that someone (Lisanne or Kris) WAS there. If the two were dead by this point however, your options are very limited, especially in the scenario suggested by the Podcast where the two were horrifically assaulted and eventually possibly beaten to death."-A local indigenous tour guide also confirms the story of what happened to Kris and Lisanne, but alters a few details. These guys from the Bandida kidnapped and murdered Kris and Lisanne, but not at the house of Cuervo in Palo Alto. But instead they killed them in guide F's finca in the jungle. "In one of the houses they have around here, in [inaudible, something like Jaramillo], they had those girls. They supposedly killed the girls the second or the third day they had them. That stuff about Palo Alto is a lie. They were never in Palo Alto. These women had nothing to do with Pata de Macho". He knows the details from the person who was called to help clean up the bloody mess, a Ngäbe-Buglé man from Alto Romero, who told the story to his sister, who jabbered it further. But this prime witness is afraid to talk and does not show up for an arranged meeting with the podcast makers...
-Local guide Balbino Salmudio tells Kryt and Atencio that he helped in 2014 as a guide for the Panamanian justice department and that back then, the justice department already tried to interview this same Ngäbe-Buglé witness. "The head of the justice department sent Balbino with two agents to interrogate this specific Ngäbe-Buglé man. They found him at guide F's farm. Guide F. showed up during the interrogation. He was very angry. At first he thought they were just regular citizens and his temper was on full display. But then he saw their badges, and toned it down a bit. 'Why are you asking about this case when the case is closed?', guide F. said to the agents. He wanted to cut short the interview and interrogation with X." And guide F. was successful, stopped the interview and sent the agents off his land. "He is a very smart man. I can't exactly say he is dangerous, but there is something about him. He thinks X knows something of which guide F. doesn't want him to talk."
-The podcast makers create an image of most of Boquete and Alto Romero inhabitants knowing about this story of what actually happened to the Dutch girls. You can wonder: if the village was familiar with the fate of the two young European tourists, then they were probably also aware that the search upstream in early June was a complete sham. It adds some further explanation as to why everyone involved agreed to stop searching when they reached the bridge and found the handful of selected and planted bone remains. These indigenous people for a good part worked for the powerful Gonzalez family or were dependent on them for things. Whether it was said aloud, or just left as an unspoken awareness, they all quite possibly knew this was staged and untruthful.
-How can we know whether or not this is all rumour, embellished as the story passed along from resident to resident, or if it captures the truth?-Police interviewed this taxi driver Leonardo twice, but he changed his story and never mentioned to them that he had ran into the Bandida when driving back into town. Margarita claims that Murgas told her that Leonardo also changed his story and the date and time when he dropped off the Dutch girls. And that he initially didn't want to talk to police, unless there was security. "Because I know if I talk, they will kill me". Leonardo drowned a few weeks before Murgas was killed.
-The podcast also taught us that Leonardo the taxi felt threatened, did not want to talk to police ánd also changed his story to police over time. This should have been further investigated back then, just like the bothersome conflicting witness statements of those living on or near the Pianista trail. Martina, Oliva, the Il Pianista people, the guy from the convenience shop.. They are all unreliable apparently, because their recollections don't match the times on the camera. But those witness statements should have garnered more investigation, not less. Or mindless binning.
-Within a short timeframe, Jose Manuel Murgas himself was run down by a car. Martin says that the hit and run killing of Jose Manuel Murgas was no accident, despite police (again) ruling it as such. "He had blows to the head that are not compatible with a hit and run accident." Two witnesses who came forward made it sound like Murgas was run over on purpose. "A city official from the Alto Boquete area tells me: 'I heard a car pull up and they open it, like a pickup truck door, and they closed it. They backed the car up and they accelerated and drove off'." And another woman, who lives across the street of where the killing happened, heard voices coming from the car. "On the property across the street from where they found mister Jose Manuel Murgas, she says she heard a vehicle. That she stopped and heard some voices, saying 'Hurry up! Leave him there! Throw him, leave him there. Come on, come on, come on!"
-The swimming photo reportedly came from Osman Valenzuela's phone. But this is not confirmed and it may have come from someone else's phone in fact. This podcast provides so many new and interesting leads and interviews, but fails to mention the swimming photo. Not even to discredit it. I wonder why? Especially considering it are Osman and Murgas pictured in it; two people who's history have been detailed to such an extent in this podcast series. To me, the swimming photo is tangible evidence. Whether or not we deem it logical or plausible or not that Kris and Lisanne would go swimming with these contemporaries; that photo is at least something tangible that was somehow documented. As opposed to the stories from Martin and Murgas and Osman and Margarita for which we have no hard evidence (no supporting CCTV footage, photos, text messages, nothing). Whereas the NFI looked at this actual swimming photo and declared it not a fake photo but an authentic photo. They just don't believe that Kris and Lisanne are pictured. You know my take on that, I disagree. The two guys in the swimming photo are Osman and Murgas. This was confirmed by the source and Juan and I found excellent matching comparison photos of them both. The photo is called 'Sabroson', so that may hint at the photographer being Edwin, or perhaps to the location, as the Sabroson chain also has a restaurant in the Caldera area.. So where does this swimming picture get placed in the new suggested narrative? According to Martin and Margarita? We don't know, as they omitted it entirely. But that swimming photo reportedly came from Osman Valenzuela's phone. The people who leaked it turned out to be have also shared the authentic night photos and the real diary entries. This gives the swimming photo more credibility in effect. So: this podcast provides so many new and interesting leads and interviews, but fails to mention the swimming photo. I wonder why? Is that because Osman's mother does not believe that her son was somewhat more closely linked to Kris and Lisanne's disappearance? Notice how he has been cast entirely in the role of well-intending collateral damage. Yet, he was close to the fire often. 
-While we do not know how the swimming photo could fit into the timeline exactly, that swimming photo may have been taken on someone else's phone and the bust-up might have been something that the gang may have teased Osman with. Or it was taken in order to frame the two lads who both were murdered some time later? It forms the only physical evidence of any local youth out and about with Kris and Lisanne. Given the amount of threatening that went on and given how shrewd the ringleaders (Tito and Sabroson) seem, I wouldn't be surprised if this photo was taken by one of them on purpose. To be used against Osman and Murgas, if needed. Reaching or not, this fits in with the type of behaviour and scheming we have been told about by Martin and Margarita. I wouldn't even rule out the theoretical possibility that Kris and Lisanne showed more interest in Osman and Murgas than they did in Henry and Edwin, and that jealousy played a role here also. And that those two self-declared kingpins didn't tolerate this. Osman was better looking and taller than that toad Henry. And let's not even start about Edwin. - By the way, in the press Margarita has stated that the family NEVER got Osman's phone back from the police. Not sure if they still don't have his phone at this point in time. But the timeline is a mess no matter what. We may have been fed an incorrect timeline by Miriam and Eileen for all we know. Kris and Lisanne may not have been at Miriam's place every evening after all. She and guide F. and Ingrid had a lucrative package deal collaboration at the time. guide F. knew where Kris and Lisanne were staying and how to get to Miriam's place, according to the police files. Despite having testified that he only saw them briefly on Tuesday morning. These people may play in cahoots together. The red line throughout the podcast is how this particular group and family goes about threatening anyone left right and center. Why would they have left Miriam alone in that respect?
When we go by their past behaviour in Bocas, we can look at Lisanne's diary entries for March 26+27+28: "Around 5’oclock we close off and we go into the town center for a bit, to see nice shops and stalls. We walked past the Wine Bar and decided to eat there. Shared 3 small appetizers and a glass of wine. Wednesday evening means only one thing: Aqua Lounge!" As Power Pixie then states: "This is uncanny in a way as it almost mirrors what happens on Sunday according to Ferrara's witness. Did Kris and Lisanne yearn for Bocas and in thus doing so, did they take up the offer to explore a place to eat, then were spotted by someone and later on made a little date to visit this "discotheque" in Boquete on Sunday? Five hours is a lot of time to be spending solely in Boquete's main town square, and also at the SBR, before going back to Miriam's by sunset or ~6:39pm. We have no information on their bank activity or credit card activity. No GPS data from either phone for Sunday or Monday, never mind the day they go missing." - Anyway, I understand that this swimming thing is hard to fit into the existing timeline. But the photo shows late afternoon sunlight. I do not trust Miriam necessarily and her story of Kris and Lisanne hanging around her house all evening, with Lisanne chatting with Miriam (she barely spoke Spanish...) and Kris "reading a book"... She could have made that up or confused the first evening they stayed there with the 2nd or 3rd (when they were out). That would leave all of Sunday afternoon and evening wide open, timeline wise.
-Those phone logs are also a very interesting topic anyway. I don't even have a smartphone and know not that much about this topic, but Power Pixie does and has really looked into this. He says that the phone logs seem incomplete. For instance, one of the phones showed a big drop in battery on the afternoon of April 1st. At a time when these phones were in a mobile dead zone. And were not actively used to try to call (yet) or take photos. And the phone logs do not offer any explanation for this. No info about background app activity for instance. That is odd. And there is more oddness, but I hope in the near future this research can be turned into another blog post perhaps. It begs the question though: how complete are those phone logs? Knowing that Pittí messed with the SD card; what are the odds that she provided an incomplete or perhaps even altered set of phone logs to the case files? The NFI had to do with what she and her team delivered to them, and Pitti had access to all these devices in the days before they were shipped to the Netherlands. Hence why they had to work with already brightened and rotated night photos. If these logs are not 100% correct, it could in theory open the door for Kris and Lisanne having come back off the mountain again. Matching many witness accounts. Now that option is excluded due to the phone logs not showing a reconnection of these phones to the network. But how correct is that log information?
-A detective who worked on the official Kris and Lisanne case at the time confirms that "The community knows about this information". That the Dutch girls were at a party in the area of Palo Alto in a house. "A cabin in a precarious condition. A cabin, well not a nice one. And that at the cabin there was consumption of alcohol and consumption of drugs." The Boquete police knew about this party in 2014 through an informant. "Certain things got out of hand with the people who were at that party with the Dutch girls. The missing girls. And certain things happened which resulted in deaths. Sex, drugs, music; that's the information that was circling around. Names were mentioned such as Sabroson, Sam John, Murgas, the son of guide F., who was a tour guide. And he was even the same tour guide who was going to take the Dutch girls to the places they agreed on." This information was submitted to the prosecutor's office and in the case report. But not for long. "The investigator and another person prepared a report and submitted it to the public ministry. They mentioned these names. These names, mentioned places, mentioned dates, mentioned events of how the party actually took place." But the report is no longer there in the case files. "They [the prosecutor's office] were unsatisfied with the report, because it went against the main line of investigation. Well, what happened to it? That's an good question. It would be interesting to investigate if that report was incorporated into a larger file. I haven't had access to the report, it's with the prosecutor in charge." Well well, surprise surprise: this detailed report about the party was never further pursued by Pitti and her team. Just placed at the bottom of some big stack of files. In a backroom. Never to be seen again. Case closed.
-This party shed theory is also the theory of Martin Ferrara O'Donnell, and it differs slightly from what Margarita had told and has heard, namely that Kris and Lisanne ended up in Cuervo's house in Palo Alto. He also names some similar and some different perpetrators. The proposed theories are not all the same. I think Ferrara placed them in a party shed behind the Pianista the night they disappeared? And not in Cuervo's house in Palo Alto. And that in details, his version differs from what Margarita was told. The almost retired policeman also mentioned such a party shed. There are rough similarities in the stories, but some details differ. Indeed, some of Margarita's details at least could be wrong (and some seem illogical even, like the hacksaw having been used, when there were no markings of this found on the few retrieved bones; or the night photo being the result of a 3rd party getting the remains out of bin bags again).
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-Some more background info on Martin Ferrara O'Donnell: he worked as a private detective on this case and was also shortly hired by several expats in Boquete to investigate what may have happened to Kris and Lisanne. It was through Lee Zeltzer and Alto al Crimen, the local crime prevention organization, that O'Donnell was hired for his investigation of the disappearance. Because Lee Zeltzer was of the belief that "Those of us who live here know that if we leave the matter to the local police, it is unlikely to be resolved." You can read more about that here. Martín Ferrara O'Donnell claimed later that Alto al Crimen hired him for only three or five days. For five years he then continued to investigate the case at his own peril and expense. He continued the searches after the payments stopped and is said to believe that Kris and Lisanne were murdered and dismembered. Osman Valenzuela and José Manuel Murgas were both also victims of the same (local) criminal youth gang he believes, which also consists supposedly of the often mentioned/described local psychopath youngster. One of them has a red truck. Ferrara calls them a bunch of misfits. Among them is a psychopath, a man who grew up as a spoiled child; his parents are even said to be afraid of him. The second man is a thief, while a third is an 'easily manipulated homosexual who wants to be accepted'. Kris and Lisanne would have trusted the boys, but under the influence of drink and drugs the atmosphere changed.
He believes that Osman Valenzuela only saw the Dutch women once, and that was at the Adolfo Médica park in Boquete. Martin also believes that Kris and Lisanne partied and slept in a hut beyond the summit of the Mirador on the night of April 1st. It lies on a road towards Boquete Tree Trek, where several local youngsters worked at that time, including Henry. Henry must have passed Cuervo's house regularly therefore. I myself still keep the option open that those 80 something dollars which Kris and Lisanne carried in their backpack, may perhaps have been meant for a Tree Trek adventure. Cuervo and Henry physically being at that spot regularly, also opens the possibility of them having known of the Pata de Macho trail. Martin Ferrara O'Donnell said that there is indeed a road through the Tree Trek park that leads very near to the house where Kris and Lisanne partied in the night of April 1 to 2. It was supposedly on the way back down to Boquete on April 2nd that some of the daytime photos were taken. He also believes that the camera times and the chronological order of the photos have been messed with at a later time. And what's more; just like Juan he believes that some photos were taken at Piedra de Lino (near the hostel of Pedro, where the girls were reportedly seen by several witnesses) and not on the Pianista trail, but that the photos were messed with to create a fake 'innocent afternoon walk turned accident' narrative. He also believes that the girls received a fateful lift that day. A friendly get together with local male youth, where alcohol and drugs were later introduced, turned at some point into a dangerous situation for the Dutch women. This detective believes that both Jose Manuel and Osman were murdered. All four young people in the swimming photo were victims in all this. He is also not convinced that Kris and Lisanne called the emergency services themselves on April 1st and beyond. But a bit of good news: the taxi driver Leonardo was not a murder victim according to the detective.
The parents of Kris and Lisanne apparently knew nothing of Martin's investigation. They made him feel they thought they were better than the Panamanians, supposedly. He accuses the authorities of having made many mistakes and says that they underestimated him. His theory is based on testimonies and proven facts; he knows who killed Kris and Lisanne, and possibly where and when. Corona has put everything on hold, but he's working on bringing the perpetrators to justice and has already spoken to the prosecutor's office in Panama. Also interesting: a local expat woman contacted Juan in the past and told him that she and a team of former army men also offered the parents of Kris and Lisanne help, right at the start of the searches. They offered to do their own investigation in Boquete. She has provided some evidence of this. These guys were former American militaries and they believed that they could find out much more than local police. But the parents REFUSED to work with them. Afraid that they would be ripped off by them. This really offended the team and they were like: you know what? Good luck with Pitti then. So I think there could be some truth in Martin's claims also. The parents were probably overwhelmed and totally unprepared for anything. They of course should have accepted such help, I mean even Ferrara's help would have been beneficial I think. But it appears they put their trust in the case officials and may even have been rude to some extent, or appear rude in their dismissal of other help offered. But notice how there were multiple expats who instantly went over to action mode, when the news broke of Kris and Lisanne's disappearance. Interesting indeed.. What does that tell us about the general reputation of local law enforcement there, in cases of missing women? Their reputation cannot have been great. Lee Zeltzer openly expressed how little trust he had in local police. Same for former police chef Erik Westra who lives in or near Boquete. Other rich expats (also Dutch ones) gathered money as well for private detectives. It were privates who first interviewed the people living alongside the Pianista trail, not Pitti and her team.
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-Some more background info on Martin Ferrara O'Donnell: he worked as a private detective on this case and was also shortly hired by several expats in Boquete to investigate what may have happened to Kris and Lisanne. It was through Lee Zeltzer and Alto al Crimen, the local crime prevention organization, that O'Donnell was hired for his investigation of the disappearance. Because Lee Zeltzer was of the belief that "Those of us who live here know that if we leave the matter to the local police, it is unlikely to be resolved." You can read more about that here. Martín Ferrara O'Donnell claimed later that Alto al Crimen hired him for only three or five days. For five years he then continued to investigate the case at his own peril and expense. He continued the searches after the payments stopped and is said to believe that Kris and Lisanne were murdered and dismembered. Osman Valenzuela and José Manuel Murgas were both also victims of the same (local) criminal youth gang he believes, which also consists supposedly of the often mentioned/described local psychopath youngster. One of them has a red truck. Ferrara calls them a bunch of misfits. Among them is a psychopath, a man who grew up as a spoiled child; his parents are even said to be afraid of him. The second man is a thief, while a third is an 'easily manipulated homosexual who wants to be accepted'. Kris and Lisanne would have trusted the boys, but under the influence of drink and drugs the atmosphere changed.He believes that Osman Valenzuela only saw the Dutch women once, and that was at the Adolfo Médica park in Boquete. Martin also believes that Kris and Lisanne partied and slept in a hut beyond the summit of the Mirador on the night of April 1st. It lies on a road towards Boquete Tree Trek, where several local youngsters worked at that time, including Henry. Henry must have passed Cuervo's house regularly therefore. I myself still keep the option open that those 80 something dollars which Kris and Lisanne carried in their backpack, may perhaps have been meant for a Tree Trek adventure. Cuervo and Henry physically being at that spot regularly, also opens the possibility of them having known of the Pata de Macho trail. Martin Ferrara O'Donnell said that there is indeed a road through the Tree Trek park that leads very near to the house where Kris and Lisanne partied in the night of April 1 to 2. It was supposedly on the way back down to Boquete on April 2nd that some of the daytime photos were taken. He also believes that the camera times and the chronological order of the photos have been messed with at a later time. And what's more; just like Juan he believes that some photos were taken at Piedra de Lino (near the hostel of Pedro, where the girls were reportedly seen by several witnesses) and not on the Pianista trail, but that the photos were messed with to create a fake 'innocent afternoon walk turned accident' narrative. He also believes that the girls received a fateful lift that day. A friendly get together with local male youth, where alcohol and drugs were later introduced, turned at some point into a dangerous situation for the Dutch women. This detective believes that both Jose Manuel and Osman were murdered. All four young people in the swimming photo were victims in all this. He is also not convinced that Kris and Lisanne called the emergency services themselves on April 1st and beyond. But a bit of good news: the taxi driver Leonardo was not a murder victim according to the detective.
The parents of Kris and Lisanne apparently knew nothing of Martin's investigation. They made him feel they thought they were better than the Panamanians, supposedly. He accuses the authorities of having made many mistakes and says that they underestimated him. His theory is based on testimonies and proven facts; he knows who killed Kris and Lisanne, and possibly where and when. Corona has put everything on hold, but he's working on bringing the perpetrators to justice and has already spoken to the prosecutor's office in Panama. Also interesting: a local expat woman contacted Juan in the past and told him that she and a team of former army men also offered the parents of Kris and Lisanne help, right at the start of the searches. They offered to do their own investigation in Boquete. She has provided some evidence of this. These guys were former American militaries and they believed that they could find out much more than local police. But the parents REFUSED to work with them. Afraid that they would be ripped off by them. This really offended the team and they were like: you know what? Good luck with Pitti then. So I think there could be some truth in Martin's claims also. The parents were probably overwhelmed and totally unprepared for anything. They of course should have accepted such help, I mean even Ferrara's help would have been beneficial I think. But it appears they put their trust in the case officials and may even have been rude to some extent, or appear rude in their dismissal of other help offered. But notice how there were multiple expats who instantly went over to action mode, when the news broke of Kris and Lisanne's disappearance. Interesting indeed.. What does that tell us about the general reputation of local law enforcement there, in cases of missing women? Their reputation cannot have been great. Lee Zeltzer openly expressed how little trust he had in local police. Same for former police chef Erik Westra who lives in or near Boquete. Other rich expats (also Dutch ones) gathered money as well for private detectives. It were privates who first interviewed the people living alongside the Pianista trail, not Pitti and her team.
-How does Martin O'Donnells theory fit in with Margarita's information? When it comes to the stories spread around town, I suspect that there has been one main source for this, probably Margarita (based on what both Osman and Murgas told her over time). Or maybe also the Alto Romero clean up guy. And that her or their stories went on a wander once they told others, and spread through town. Martin Ferrara O'Donnell worked on this case pretty much from the get go. Being first asked by Alto Crimen people to investigate, then receiving some money potentially from other expats to keep researching. There must have come a point where it seemed too late and a shame for him to stop and drop all he had done so far. But I feel that Martin may have only gotten a few things correct. Not the finer details. Some details make no sense in his theory, for instance that Kris and Lisanne would have walked the Pianista trail on April 2nd.. Without being seen there that day. After some party night in a shed. And without going back to Miriam's place. So when we combine the stories of Margarita, the clean up native ánd Martin, an image does form based on the more or less overlapping details.
-As Power-Pixie stated: “Osman's mother refused to meet with Arrocha. Why? I don't get it. Now she's condemning the gang and wants others to help find the killers of her son? She should have joined forces with Arrocha and the parents and helped draw this out in public. Arrocha would have at least made noise and asked for Osman's phone and make it known that the police were hiding things. He went up against Pitti and drummed up similar noise, so this would only add more to the weight on her shoulders.”
-As Power-Pixie stated: “Osman's mother refused to meet with Arrocha. Why? I don't get it. Now she's condemning the gang and wants others to help find the killers of her son? She should have joined forces with Arrocha and the parents and helped draw this out in public. Arrocha would have at least made noise and asked for Osman's phone and make it known that the police were hiding things. He went up against Pitti and drummed up similar noise, so this would only add more to the weight on her shoulders.”
-The only thing the podcast makers actually do find in the case files, is that an anonymous informant mentioned the name of Murgas to police in October of 2014. Stating that Jose Manuel Murgas 'may have important information in this case'. The cops did follow up on this, but Murgas did not confess to them and denied being present at any murder. He even denied having ever met Kris and Lisanne. 'But he did cast suspicion on the members of the Bandida, especially 'Tito'. He said a group of guys in town, Tito, Edwin and Sam John, might have something to do with their deaths'. In the official case report: "He [Murgas] added that at the time the girls disappeared, Henry told him what the problem was. That they were lost and he was the last one to see them. According to the interviewee, he did not see Henry in the area until about six days later. And when he asked him where he had been, Henry told him that he had gone to his fathers farm in Culebra, to go for a walk. And when he asked him where he went for a walk, Henry changed the subject." At the very end of the report, the anonymous information gives a detailed description of the red pickup truck with a double cabin and shiny silver rims and tinted windows, in which Edwin had been seen driving around town. That's all that ended up in the final case files. They all gave each other nicknames.
Henry = Tito
Edwin 'Sabroson' A. = El Pulpo
Osman Valenzuela = Piki
Murgas - Murdog
Cesar S. = La Cuervo
Efrain Manuel Rios Gonzalez = Adonis
(He got locked up in 2018 for the brutal rape and murder of a 50 year old woman in Boquete).
Sam John D. = Samy
Podcast Opinions from Scarlet
I did find these last episodes very interesting. And I think the podcast was well made. Out of all the people who publicly wrote about this case, Jeremy Kryt is my favourite. Because he has a thorough and journalistic approach to things. Because he seems honest and was willing to make a u-turn and correct his earliest convictions about this disappearance case. And also because he seems a relatively humble person. Sure, he put his Daily Beast articles behind a paywall in the end, but he does not appear to milk this tragic case for money. Here Jeremy Kryt clearly tried to keep an open mind and did not want to veer too far off this time (either towards an accident or a murder), but Mariana Atencio seemed very convinced of the narrative presented by O'Donnell and Margarita Valenzuela. Without knowing anything about the production process or what they did behind the scenes, it appears they did a good job investigating this case further. There are so many witnesses by now and so many contradictory statements made, that it is near impossible to know who is speaking the truth and who is trying to manipulate the truth. But the podcast team also set straight simple factual things. They confirmed for instance that the night photo could not have been shot near a monkey bridge. That notion was suggested by several local tour guides, but seems ready to be thrown in the metaphorical bin. I also really appreciated that Kryt and Atencio traveled to Boquete and had feet on the ground there, and managed to personally interview as many people as they did. Including very interesting and knowledgeable people such as the coroner, the forensic anthropologist, Osman's mother and Martin Ferrara O'Donnell. I know that the last one offered his detective work to other parties for a significant amount of money, but I do believe that he sincerely looked into the case and came up with new leads. Of course people are going to shout that anyone who makes a buck from this case is suspicious by association, but let's face it: when people in the Pittí camp do so (including Pittí herself) it's all fine and 'professional', but when people who believe in a crime do it, they are supposedly untrustworthy opportunists. It shows the bias of the commentators themselves, most of all. And it makes no difference if people work for nothing and do so out of a sense of justice seeking, because I never made a single cent from my blog series and youtube videos, and I am getting trashed on a certain forum as well for being biased and whatnot :) So you can't win if you stray from the official accident assumption. Mostly everyone tries to make money when it comes to covering this case. I find it so hypocritical of Losters especially to discredit people like youtubers they don't agree with, or Martin Ferrara O'Donnell who they do not agree with, based on money. When in fact Pitti does not even get out of bed unless she is paid; will not speak to the podcast makers unless she is paid. Biased authors made money using other people's work: used a ton of Juan and my own (freely available, non-monetized) research for money without even a footnote used to name their sources, then going against the parents' clear wishes in monetizing their biased scribblings. The Canadians and IP are all spending money to get their info from various sources. The podcast makers made money with their production. Either it is fine for everyone who worked on this case to make money, or for nobody. I think that Martin is dealing with some threats for his safety too. This is Panama baby, Ferrara will believe that after all the years of investigating (or so he claims) and after the personal threats to his safety he has to live with, he also wants some cash for his work. And why shouldn't he? That's the real world. It is amusing to me that the only two people who throw everything they know in this case online for free, Juan and myself, are most often under fire. But that's also the real world. Too bad, never mind.
So content wise, I found the podcast well made and very interesting. But I also struggle with the podcast info tbh. Yes, it can all link together. But at this point we lack hard forensic scientific data to prove the allegations. We can also not be fully sure that all the people who talked (Murgas, the local guides etc) were passing on firsthand information, or 2nd or even 3rd hand info. Or what alternate motives people who were interviewed may have had. I do believe the overall notion that Kris and Lisanne met foul play at the hands of locals. But unless hard evidence is produced about this pandilla, it will just keep hanging in the air as yet another possible theory I think. I now wished we had been presented with undeniable facts, When it comes to the findings of O'Donnell and the testimonies of Margarita Valenzuela in particular. CCTV footage, photos, text messages, you name it. Now we just have to believe the (very detailed and believable) stories. How come for instance, that it was reported initially in local news articles that Osman had gone to the river with a gathering of 'relatives', and had excused himself for a toilet break as his relatives were packing up? Never to return? Now the story is tweaked and Osman was in fact not with his family but with Henry, Edwin, Milagros, Murgas..? With Milagros initially signaling the Bandidas baddies. How can this change in narrative be explained? Is this also the result of these interrogated youthful witnesses being shielded and kept out of the actual narrative by some people with power? Not even the media reported on them and of course disastrous Pittí also never alluded to that segment in the police report of this case... Milagros' actions, by the way, struck me as well. She befriended Osman, then ruthlessly betrayed him. She knew all about Kris and Lisanne apparently and the strong impression is given that she is completely loyal to Edwin Sabroson and helped both disciplining and controlling the gang members and hangers-on. It is impossible to know whether she had any involvement with the aftermath of the two's death, but she is sketched out here as having been an important part of Edwin's operation at this time. (A Black Widow).
In the podcast, Mariana says that Margarita 'beliefs' that the Bandida guys staged the phone calls. But I do wonder: how would these very young guys from Panama have known what the Dutch emergency number was? If this was an unplanned spur of the moment crime, why would they spontaneously start calling 112 on the afternoon of April 1st? To me it makes more sense that Kris and Lisanne made those initial two calls themselves. Perhaps at a time when they could still do so undetected. Perhaps because they felt unsafe or worried, while frogmarching over the Pata de Macho? And that once they were struck unconscious, the 3rd party took the phones off them and simply repeated those calls. Then added some 911 attempts as well. But as Power-Pixie says correctly: "The phone logs can no longer become a major roadblock. The phone logs are a mix and match of information that nobody has access to the originals, just like the photos off the main memory cards."
We also end up with a problematic timeline when we have to believe Margarita that it was Edwin who went out into the jungle to shoot the series of night pictures. I didn't hear her about when exactly he did so. Was it on the actual night of April 8th, as the photo data implies? How then is it possible that we see the back of Kris' head in photo #580? She does not look beaten around the head there. And we were told that the Bandida beat her to death, shortly after coming down the Pianista... Does that mean that those night photos were taken much earlier than April 8th and that the engrained photo data was manipulated? It all gets very complicated and premeditated suddenly. Is that believable for a crime of passion and opportunity by some local youth? Or is this really what the head of a body looks like when taken out of a bin bag, eight days later, in a humid place like Boquete? I doubt it. And as for the missing photo #509: I do believe that the reason why it was removed was because someone or some people were pictured on it. Or because #509 was perhaps a photo which showed Kris and Lisanne had turned back from the stream, back towards the Mirador and Boquete (visually contradicting the official's 'lost in the jungle' narrative of choice). Pitti to me seems mighty shifty and well able to mess with the case evidence. But we also did not hear from Margarita how exactly that photo #509 was deleted so thoroughly. We know that simply pressing 'delete' was not going to permanently get rid of the photo. So how did they do this? Did the Bandida members figure that out themselves? Or did computer savvy parents perhaps help out there? It goes pretty far to assume they all committed the perfect crime, in the spur of the moment, without any pre-planning. [Although in all honesty, we also have to give Betzaida Pittí and her investigational performance some 'credit' there also].Something else that makes me wonder if Margarita's statement can be fully correct, is that for it to be true, Kris and Lisanne must have been totally secretive about their meetings with the Bandida lads. There is nothing mentioned in either of their diaries, as far as we know, of meeting Edwin and Henry, or Murgas and Osman. Nothing about trying to score weed. Nor about drinking beer with these locals. Nothing about a party. Sigrid also didn't testify hearing them talk about this on Monday evening. Although I do believe that the public may be mistaken in believing that Kris and Lisanne were wallflowers who just sat on the couch with Miriam every night (we only have her word for that anyway) and wanted to teach children primarily, we also have to look at their previous behaviour They enjoyed socialising in Bocas. They enjoyed going out to dance and drink to a certain degree. They rotated towards young men their own age in Bocas and didn't sit around in their room every evening, reading a book. So why would they suddenly do that in Boquete? Add to this that Lisanne was anxious and panicky after arriving there. She wrote about this very vividly in her diary, the days before her disappearance. Marijuana is freely available in the Netherlands, and as little of a deal as smoking a cigarette. Perhaps they wanted to buy some weed to help Lisanne feel less anxious and stressed out? The fact that there is no mention of drugs in the diary entries we know of, makes me honestly weary that they would suddenly want to score not-so-legal drugs in Boquete. But we cannot rule the suggestion out either.
And I also wonder why the swimming photo was never mentioned by the podcast makers, nor by Margarita Valenzuela? It was doing the rounds in Boquete and I am sure she heard about it or saw the photo. Same for Martin Ferrara O'Donnell. That photo shows Osman for certain, with Murgas and what really does seem to be Kris and Lisanne. How does that photo fit in with the storyline? And in how far does it place Osman into the disappearance narrative? Because it implies a lot more involvement of him with Kris and Lisanne than the suggested spotting of them in a car with Henry, Edwin and Murgas, from a distance. Perhaps the swimming photo is not authentic. Perhaps it is not what it seems to be to me. But isn't Margarita the right person then to at least show the photo to and ask if she recognizes the two young men? Ask about anything she might want to say about it or thinks about it? Now the swimming photo was just completely ignored. Nahhh. Osman also worked at Boquete Tree Trek with Henry, something we also didn't hear Osman's mother mention. She puts her son quite far apart from the Bandida. So is it possible that Osman was more involved in 'things' than his mother wants to talk about, or maybe even wants to believe?Nevertheless, I have believed for a very long time that foul play was involved. As for who exactly killed Kris and Lisanne... that remains a mystery in my opinion. Has the tour guide been covering up for someone else? Possibly. As it makes sense for him going out of his ways like he did, injecting himself in the disappearance aftermath to the extent that he did, if there is a relative of his involved and needing covering up. But as I stressed in earlier blog posts as well: Guide F. and anyone else mentioned in this case remains innocent until proven guilty. And for now there is still no such hard evidence. Not about him and not about anybody else. Although we can document what various people have said in the media so far about this disappearance, or what they have otherwise published publicly. I do believe that Kris and Lisanne were murdered, but it is not clear at this point by who and why. I also believe the multiple stories coming from Boquete and also from locals who emailed me in private about this, regarding 'Tito's' rather problematic psychological state. So I find Margareta's narrative plausible, in theory. But we lack hard facts. And that is a little bit disappointing, after nearly 7 hours of podcast listening. Margarita may be right about her son telling her directly that he was afraid of being murdered. And that he saw the Dutch girls in Edwin's red truck, in Boquete. But we just have to believe her there, as until now (so over eight years long) she kept those details out of the big press. Why is that? I am not sure how convincing that makes her. And when it comes to her theory about the Bandidas killing Osman at the river: that story was told to her by Murgas, supposedly. We have no evidence that he really did so and we have no evidence that the bad boy clique (and their female black spider) actually murdered him. It is, unfortunately, hearsay. But the very brutal and very untimely deaths of both Osman and Murgas, give this story more weight I think.
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And with regards to the discovery of the Pata de Macho trail: I am still reeling that this back road without cell reception was discovered by Kryt and Atencio. And that it was hidden from the media and the public debate for as long as it was. Guide F. is also not spared in this podcast and it is shocking what we get to hear about him from witnesses with regards to his antics over the past years. The multiple claims of him threatening people and manipulating the investigation in particular. The image creeps up now of a man with great power, threatening people while playing the good guy in front of the media lenses. Someone who was shielded and protected by certain people. But as for him successfully threatening Sinaproc members away from this Pata de Macho trail? I cannot believe that to be honest. If that trail existed and is situated roughly between Palo Alto and the Mirador, then locals would have known about it. Sinaproc would have known about it. And guide F. was not present at the Pata de Macho trail day and night when the searches took off, in order to ban others from entering it. That is a bit of an absurd claim to me, although of course I don't live in Panama and don't know if such a claim is really as nonsensical as it seems to me European. But I saw the footage of the Sinaproc army-style men, and I know what guide F. looks like, and it is hard to imagine him powerful enough in any way to order search groups away from a trail that should have been checked after Kris and Lisanne disappeared.
And I wonder: how influential is the ND5 gang? Was it a predominant force within Boquete at the time, or just one more bunch of machismo chancers and very youthful wannabe gangsters who love to look menacing in selfies (below Cuervo and Tito, spot "Plinio's" thumbs) while listening to rap music and shift some dope? But otherwise being all bark and no bite? Somehow it is difficult for me to imagine either of them as intricate masterminds who thought out the staging of night photos, the manipulation of photo files and emergency calls and the late staging of the backpack.
CONCLUDING: The Panamanian prosecution failed (refused) to look beyond an accident verdict. So they did not look for evidence of foul play. Same for Pitti and her biographists. So people can keep up now that 'there IS no evidence of foul play'. But when you do not look for any evidence, you won't find it either. Pitti and her team made some critical errors. She should have approached this disappearance with an open mind, should have verified the comings and goings of guide F., the Bandida/pandilla and any other potential people of interest.. Because we only know about the people who made it into the media, whereas Pitti should have had a much better idea of everyone local who needed to be further looked into. Pitti should have made work of CCTV footage sightings; should have taken other witnesses serious; should have discovered whose fingerprints and DNA were found on the belongings (we still don't know, anno 2023!). Should have used luminol in potential places of interest. Should have mapped and traced active phones in the area on April 1st. She should have insisted on a much more extensive report from the NFI on all the girls' phone activity in Panama; not just of April 1st and afterwards. She should have taken witnesses such as Murgas more seriously and professionally investigated witness claims. But the investigators, led by her, turned a blind eye to mostly everything that did not back up her own chosen explanation of an accident. An accident which she never provided a shred of hard evidence for. Juan contacted the Dutch Prosecution in the recent past and had a Cold Case team review this Kris and Lisanne case again. But they concluded that they see no reason to reopen the case and they play the ball back to Panama, saying that only the Panamanian prosecution can reopen this case. And only if they themselves want to. So far, no signs of that. This same Dutch prosecution (OM) has been accused by the Dutch Safety Board report, published in early March 2023, of failing Peter R. de Vries. Failing to give him the much needed protection, as a result of which he was executed in the middle of Amsterdam by criminals in 2021.MY END THEORY (FOR NOW)
This theory is based on the assumption for now, for argument's sake, that the podcast info is correct. We (Power-Pixie, Dave and myself) do suspect that in fact not everything Margarita claims may be 100% correct. But for lack of other intel, let's base a theory around those claims of Margarita. (While remembering that everybody is innocent right now, from lack of any real official investigation).
So then the guess is that Kris and Lisanne ran into Henry and friends around the point of photo 508. They had met them before, so were not immediately alarmed. But they would have felt a knot of worry in their stomach to unexpectedly run into them in this wild, isolated place. The gang must have known Kris and Lisanne already at that point, and formed a special interest in them. They may have met them earlier at Bistro Boquete, at Nelvis or at that mystery restaurant where Kris and Lisanne had lunch on Monday March 31st (a place that was never further identified by the case officials; was it Sabroson's?). Kris and Lisanne had a rough few days behind them at that point. Volunteer work had fallen through, despite meticulous planning by Lisanne. She had also been panicked and homesick. Boquete turned out to be less fun than Bocas was.. Their last period of joy was with guys their own age in Bocas. I do think they would have been perceptive to some charming attempts to befriend them by guys looking like Henry and Osman. But Henry may have had different plans for them, wanting more than just some innocent banter out in town.
Who planted that Pianista trail idea in their head? A perfect spot to trap them, out of sight, isolated, with its loop road and its convenient lack of cell reception around the point where they went missing. It is the perfect location probably for a kidnapping. A wild isolated trail out of sight. Far less touristy than the Lost Waterfall tour for instance. It would provide the gang with cover, it would ensure them that once Kris and Lisanne went up they had no way to escape and had to come down the same way. Right into their trap. It also provided them with side roads to whisk them off to. And Giovanni and Doris, the parents of two of the gang members, to spin this BS story to the press about the dog Blue and how the dog came back but the girls never did. Indicating they just got lost or kept walking. We should not underestimate the power of that story initially. Until some people started to scratch their heads about the total absence of Blue in the later discovered photos.
While on this trail and moving beyond the Mirador (were they told about moving on there in order to find a waterfall?), things start to get iffy. Given how photogenic that 2nd quebrada really is, with a proper small waterfall, I think it is fair to see that Kris and Lisanne never arrived there by themselves. Or they would have photographed the spot. So they either had turned around to the Mirador already by then and were intercepted, or they were forced/ushered past the 2nd quebrada by a 3rd party, without the possibility to take pictures. Interesting as the river wading theory is at this point of the 2nd quebrada, I find it personally completely illogical and incomprehensible that Kris and Lisanne would willingly and without any pressing reason get their feet wet to wade into that rock and foliage filled stream. Leading nowhere in particular, but away from the trail. It makes no sense.
So if we are now thinking out Margarita's unproven theory, Kris and Lisanne were probably intercepted around the point of photo 508. I think Kris and Lisanne initially acted like they were all OK and did not want to show their fears too much. The group convinced them to join them towards a shortcut trail. Kris and Lisanne followed them, hoping the guys were sincere and just wanted to bring them back down to civilization asap. The moment when the first two emergency calls were made, I think it were Kris and Lisanne themselves who called. Possibly while still walking down the Pata de Macho trail. It would probably have taken them three hours to descend that trail (maybe a bit less), but I suspect there was some delay on the way down, with the guys either messing or pranking around, or already trying their luck with Kris in particular.
Kris and Lisanne must have been very uneasy at this point in order to call the European emergency number 112. Were they already touched or harassed while still on that trail? It must have happened at a moment when they were not guarded and without the clique noticing these first 112 calls being made. They automatically called the same emergency number which we would call in times of crisis in the Netherlands. But after the second failed call attempt, I think these phones were confiscated. And the passwords were forced out of Kris at the very least. Did this happen on the mountain still? Or were those calls made from Palo Alto? In that case, those phones should have reconnected to the GSM network, logically speaking. As far as we know, they didn't. Why not? (Although those logs may have been incomplete, or the phones could have had other reasons for not logging such information at the time). So normally that would be an indication of the phones either having been used further up the mountain, or in a connection free zone elsewhere. Or completely staged by a 3rd party.
Another problem with the 'harassment on the mountain' scenario is that if Kris and Lisanne truly were panicked by 4.30 PM before arriving in Palo Alto (or had been forced to hand over their phones), then I would have expected them to have screamed or protested by the time they reached the neighborhood. Sun would be down around 6.30/7'ish. But on a nice day, people surely must have noticed such commotion? Whether still in the afternoon daylight or at dusk. Even though Cuervo's place appears to be located close to the Pata de Macho trail. But since there are no such witness claims known to us (and assuming for this theory that Margareta's info is correct) it seems more likely that Kris and Lisanne kind of willingly went into Cuervo's place. And that only inside there, things went wrong.
The story of the podcast is then that the guys took them both into Cuervo's house, maybe offering them a drink or simply pushing them in. It is also possible that they 'guild-tripped' them into coming in for a drink, as a thank you for guiding them down that Pata de Macho descend. The problem is of course that IF these girls had been attacked or raped on the trail already, then why wouldn't they have screamed and balled while being frogmarched to Cuervo's house? We have seen that he lives in a neighborhood with many other houses around. You do not drag two fearful, traumatized Dutch women through a neighborhood with that many houses and inhabitants without them making a sound. So to me the chances are highest that the bad shit that happened to them, happened either elsewhere or later on inside Cuervo's house. But I also don't believe the attack happened out in the open, because there would simply have been too much potential risk of blood or trace detection on that trail. Cuervo's private house however was easy to disinfect and clean, unseen. Nobody was going to come into his place uninvited, whereas one cannot control who enters that Pata de Macho trail. Lesson 1 in kidnapping situations: Never let them take you to a new location... In Cuervo's house (or another more isolated location perhaps) things went from bad to worse.
But initially, the expectation may simply have been that Kris and Lisanne would have willingly joined in the 'fun'. Only when this supposed slap in the face was given to Henry by an annoyed and feisty Kris, did things very quickly go downhill. IF that details is true, then this shows just how young, inexperienced and unprepared these women were for a visit to this country. You probably much rather get raped and pretend and make it out alive than to slap a wannabe Panamanian macho gangster, high on testosterone in the face, while he is surrounded by his friends. This may be cool in the emancipated Netherlands, but if this scenario is true then they should have ideally gone into survival mode and play along and get the hell out of there in one piece at the end. Is it possible that those first two emergency calls were made from Cuervo's house and that this is the moment that Henry confiscated those phones and powered them off? As Power-Pixie pointed out to me; there would have been GSM connection at Cuervo's place. So those calls must have been either made earlier, up the mountain and outside of reception reach, or at another location without reception..
Back to their (hypothetical) earlier meeting with the guys in town or at Cuervo's house. If they had drinks and smokes, it even makes sense that they did not immediately write about this in their diaries. We saw them write days later about events on Bocas as well. They may simply not have had the opportunity and time yet to cover this meeting with these lads in their diaries. In that case they would have had a surprise meeting with this gang on the trail on Tuesday. Then be lured (while semi trusting their new 'friends') to the Pata de Macho trail, and from there to an isolated shed. Like Martin O'Donnell claims. A place where they would not be disturbed by others and a place where there was definitely no cell reception. And a place where the bodies would not have had to be moved through an inhabited area, before permanently getting rid of them. Perhaps the gang did promise them to all go to Cuervo's house through the shortcut trail on Tuesday afternoon, but in reality drove K+L like unsuspecting kettle to an entirely different location. And by 16.30 these girls started to become very aware of the fact they were in trouble. But.. then this place, this shed, would have contained heaps of forensic evidence. Blood, gore, DNA, hairs. With the massive search operations that took place soon after, how could they have missed such a place? You need a search warrant to enter a private house, but you don't need one for a shed out in the open, perhaps? Unless it is on someone's private property.....
If we are to believe this podcast series, Henry then goes 'missing' for a week and takes cover in Alto Romero. This does not raise suspicion with the people in Boquete, as he and his dad regularly spend time in their countryside finca's. Henry has ensured that the few lads involved are very well aware of the consequences if they talk to anyone else about what happened. Henry brings the backpack with him. They make a schedule of the most logical times those two phones have to be powered on and off, in a zone without mobile connection. They stick to sunrise times ('logical' in case of someone stuck in the wild). They think that one week, roughly, of anonymous phone activity is enough to cement the lost and perished in the wild narrative. They know nature here and can vividly imagine how long two city girls from Europe would have realistically survived out there. The two separate phones appear to be used by just one pair of hands after Tuesday April 1st. Notice how they are never used together. And the Camera is only used once more, on a night when neither phone is even switched on. All the night photos and all the emergency calls after April 1st are staged in my opinion. It is not certain who did so, and whether or not one person or multiple people partook in the scam. Guide F. would have been informed of the situation, but I feel he mainly told Henry what to do and focused himself on the decoy in Boquete. As for the night photos: someone either went out in the middle of nowhere on April 8th to patiently shoot those claustrophobic night pictures. Or they did so already on the 2nd night for instance, or much later in fact. And in that case F. or one of the others simply and manually altered the time and date settings of the Canon camera beforehand (temporarily). Dave M. made a good point about these night photos in fact having been taken on April 8th: "Day 8 makes sense in that it is at the very height of the searches and media attention. So real thought and motivation would be being spent at this point, and a plan adopted." And notice how in many of Kris and Lisanne's Pianista photos you see the backpack. It's also there at the airport as Lisanne stands with Kris as they await their flight. But bizarrely, in a hundred night photos this loyal travel companion backpack was not once captured on picture. I think because the bag was not there at all. Just a staged photo session.
Back in Boquete, problems arise from the two younger wannabe 'gang' members, Osman and Murgas. They are not part of the hard core of the group and they also do not possess the cut throat criminal mentality of them. Osman is completely panicked and traumatized about what happened. I may assume too much here, but I am pretty convinced that Osman did not tell mum the entire story. And that he was not threatened and then killed for simply having witnessed the gang and Kris and Lisanne in a car during the day in Boquete. But that he was way more involved. Maybe not joining in the nefarious parts, but present at least. As Dave M. says: "one of many things that resonates with me is the [podcast] claim that it was a group (four maybe?) of men who overwhelmed Kris and Lisanne - this makes a lot of sense." I imagine that Osman witnessed Henry torturing and killing these girls. And that he may have been threatened with death himself. And that this is why he felt paranoid about his own safety. Going by his mum's statements, also the ones she made to the press back in 2014 already, Osman was behaving very erratically. In 2014 already journalists in Boquete wrote about her saying her son was petrified of something, not acting like himself, panicked and erratic in the days before his death. And that she didn't know why. If that testimony is true then it seems reasonable that the group noticed Osman acting like a total giveaway for trouble. Murgas may have been more restrained at the time. Less of an obvious risk.
So Osman does not know what to do and in his panic decides to join Sinaproc to look for Kris and Lisanne. But the gang instinctively senses that Osman is the weakest link and is at breaking point. They know everyone in town, including Osman's mother. They know she is a hard-hearted woman when it comes to her son and they suspect that Osman will tell her about what happened in a moment of weakness. Milagros was used as bait and may have been a mafia lover type of handy accessory. A wild guess, but if Osman truly was paranoid and petrified at this stage, slightly losing the plot, then Henry inviting him over for a Caldera picnic may not have done the job. Osman did trust Milagros, they were youth friends. It is a prejudice for sure, but in none of her pictures online she looks warm and kind. In fact, she looks mean and backstabbing, the way she gleans at the camera and her smirk and eyes. It has happened before that willing women are used as bait. If true, it is one of the saddest parts of Osman's demise imo. Truly cold hearted betrayal. But they may have misjudged Milagros' ability to keep her mouth shut afterwards. Henry may have returned to the Culebra for this little hit job, or instructed Edwin and others what to do. Osman has to die and they make it look like a drowning. I don't exclude the possibility that in this close-knit community, they even know a cop or two, helping to steer the investigation away from them effectively. For the time being... Murgas is also closely watched, but manages to convince the group that he is tough like them, so they let him live. Also for now...
****SO...
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The main argument from 'Losters' is: how could a mastermind from Boquete pull off such a scam? Is it really credible that some murderer in Boquete could be thinking so quickly and come up with this time consuming decoy? Why would they go out of their way to set up a perfect fake trail? Night photo and all? It is an unusual situation I agree. Especially if we are to believe that some youth doctored this all out by themselves, under pressure. But in general it is not impossible for someone involved to be a bit shrewd and organized about staging a crime scene. I have watched docu's and youtube videos about hundreds and hundreds of crimes and cold cases over the decades and yes, this scenario is pretty rare. But they do exist, in various forms and shapes. I covered the case of Frauke Liebs on my blog for instance and it has a bizarre twist. The kidnapped young woman was forced by her killer to call and text home and reassure her family and loved ones. He thought out a complex scheme as well, using his own victim in fact. Very unusual, but these cases do exist. And as we know, some of these usual suspects in this case are crafty, cunning and smart. They also already had their fair share of 'missing' tourists in Boquete. Many were discovered or saved the next day, but this (to me) sounds like the very natural solution guide F. would have thought out. He knew about the search and rescue missions for other tourists in the past. This was a completely logical solution for him. Smart, but more so cunning and opportunistic. The beyond poor police investigation in Boquete did the rest.This does sound like a much better and fitting theory than the early (foul play) suggestion that one lonely serial killer type had intercepted Kris and Lisanne on that mountain, all by himself. Because how would one single man have taken such effective control of two young women? Yes, guide F. (for instance) is strong, yes he has a machete, but he is also tiny. And old. Whereas we have two gazelle type, tall and sporty young women here. One being skittish as it is. This theory we came up with now because of Osman's mother and the podcast makers, of the local gang youth first gaining Kris and Lisanne's trust, then prepping them for the Pianista trail and then joining them up there and luring them to their demise.. that somehow makes at least a little bit more sense. And is also fitting with what we know firsthand (the Gold Standard in a way) from their own diaries. It fits their earlier socializing behaviour (in Boas) and it fits their state of mind at the time. It covers the details we know about the phone logs. It explains the behaviours of F. in the days leading up to their disappearance and afterwards. It even ties Nelvis and the suspiciously anonymized Monday Restaurant into it all. Maybe it fits a bit too well and conveniently? It is a theory still, but it is the best one I have personally heard until now. It makes more sense also than Margareta's literal testimony. Although I do believe that some of what she has told is true. But just not necessarily all of it. Also because Osman himself probably chose to give his mum a filtered down version of events, maybe sparing her the sadness of hearing about Osman's true level of involvement in it all. It is all speculation though, in the end. We only know about the people who have been pushed forward in the media. Either because of their own behaviours and media hogging, or because of what witnesses and people like Margarita have told us. But if the case officials had done their job and had properly investigated this case in all its details, there would no doubt have been other people of interest identified. People we do not know about at this stage. So despite this very interesting podcast, I do not think we are closer to a proper solving of this case,supported by hard facts, unfortunately,
With thanks to Power-Pixie and Dave M. who continue to share their time, talents and energy to debate this case. I am really curious how this Pata de Macho trail runs exactly. The one known route, leading to Cerro Pata de Macho, appears to be at least in part a different trail, or in part the same trail but one that runs further to the north-east eventually, once our 'loop' trail is said to link to the Pianista. So I suspect there is also an exit to the North-West somewhere. See the map I made added here, but which can not yet be finalized as the exact connection trail towards the Mirador region is still unknown to us. According to Kryt and Atencio this connection isn't even a proper trail, but a path. Overgrown. Hard to see, unless you know where to look. It may not even be visible therefore on the online maps. I do wish the podcast makers - great as they are - had given more precise descriptions of where it lies and where it heads to exactly, to match all this. Perhaps when people like Victor Hugo or the IP team or Romain himself ever go back to the Pianista, they can look for this sneak Pata de Macho route back to Palo Alto... Document it properly. We have to accept for now that the Pata de Macho route marked on this map is just part of the Pate trail and eventually could lead to Cerro Pata de Macho, as indicated here. What the gang supposedly did is walk away from the Pianista, accessing this trail, then following it down just as we see it marked on that map, ending up at the Tree Trek Lodge. Where Henry and Osman worked at the time, and possibly more of the group. Here is a comparison between the two trails laid out side-by-side, made by Power-Pixie, to give an idea of what ground needed to be covered:
You can see how walking such a route would take a good three or more hours, as opposed to the straight line that is the trail from Il Pianista to the Mirador. It also suggests to us why the Pate De Macho trail is not much used anymore today, unless you live on that route (or like to do stuff unseen). What we don't know is where it starts or ends off the Mirador. That will be key when it comes to figuring out how much time was needed to move Kris and Lisanne away from the Pianista and to the Palo Alto house, as suggested by Margarita Valenzuela and others. Here is a topographical layout from Power-Pixie, that gives us an idea of the elevations that needed to be descended and ascended when you try to go from the Mirador to the Boquete Tree Trek area or the Pata de Macho trail itself.
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Is the Pata de Macho trail running somewhere down in this photo, showing Boquete in the distance?
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Dave M., Power-Pixie and I have been trying to get a bit closer to the locations hinted at in this podcast. Since we are not yet fully certain of the singled out properties I won't share images of this yet. But do check this map to get an idea of the elevations that Kris and Lisanne had to ascend and descend in order to move from the Pianista area to the Palo Alto region
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And I still believe that the photo times of the canon photos could be off.
They seemed grouped to make sense and to visually sell the 'kept walking and never returned' lost narrative. Making Kris and Lisanne appear to have walked themselves off the Pianista trail to get lost. Power-Pixie still suspects that Lisanne did not manually correct the daylight savings time for 2014, which was 1 hour ahead on March 9th. He purchased the exact same camera (and the exact same phones as Kris and Lisanne had) and says that the camera does not set this automatically, like a smartphone would. I agree. I wouldn't be surprised if it ever turns out that Kris and Lisanne took some of those Mirador photos after returning to the summit, and this is where they were intercepted by the local lads mentioned. The camera time settings were off and it were the case officials who interpreted things the way they did. Apparently they documented how they verified the right times: based on someone's wrist watch that was pictured on some photo on the camera. Of course we have never seen the evidence of this.
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As an aside: in the comment section of my videos about this podcast, some people bring up the diary entries from Lisanne
And whether or not her panicked diary entry either preluded something bad that was about to happen, or already reflected on something bad that hád happened. I had a look again and the worrisome diary entry was marked as written on March 29th, so the day they arrived in Boquete. But since Lisanne then went on to describe the last 3 days in Bocas, shifting back in time, I am not entirely sure that she wrote the March 29 entry actually on March 29th. She seemed in the habit of catching up later on with her writings. So that opens up possibilities for why exactly she felt so uneasy, panicked, emotional and why she wanted to go home suddenly. It makes you wonder what exactly in Boquete made her have such a meltdown of sorts. Before the rejection from the Aura school. It seems peculiar that just the sight of Miriam's house and the Boquete mountains in the background could trigger all that? Or did things happen which she had not felt like writing down yet? Maybe they already ran into these lads by Sunday. Perhaps Kris was all bubbly and into getting to meet them, and careful Lisanne was growing weary and panicked? It always has bugged me why she had such a mini breakdown so shortly after arriving in Boquete, seemingly. I also cannot let go of that swimming photo. And wondering where it could fit into a timeline. Can we trust that Kris and Lisanne wrote down anything and everything of importance in those diaries? We have photos from the Bocas time, which shows them hanging out with the Dutch guys and some others. They do mention them in the diaries, but not super detailed? I have kept diaries since I was eight and later would write endless details about nights out with others. Kris and Lisanne did not seem to do this and we don't know what sort of experiences and details from Bocas they may have left out of their short diary entries? Did the fact that Kris have a boyfriend at home make her leave out some details in writing perhaps? Would they have written about (theoretically) buying some weed off of Henry and friends? Flirting with men? We saw a photo in Bocas of a group playing volleyball. But we only read one line in Lisanne's diary about her having played volleyball. Casually mentioning it. Nothing more or extra about how it was for her to play her beloved sports again, after having to stop playing it in team competition due to an injury. We don't even read if her team won or lost in Bocas. How much of what they experienced was mentioned in writing? And does the fact that elements of this newly proposed crime theory are not reflected in the diary writings also mean that they never took place at all?
Update 2024
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Interestingly, some of the Pandilla gang talked to two German authors, named Christian Hardinghaus and Annette Nenner. I will dedicate a separate blog post and/or video to this new book called 'Still Lost in Panama' soon when I have more time. But it has to be said here that Annette spoke to most of the Pandilla members, after first befriending Feliciano. This is done after the shockwave causing podcast series of Jeremy Kryt. So the thought that these German authors are used here to strike back, does creep up in the mind. Most of the Pandilla members (who are all innocent at this point, just like literally everyone mentioned in this case; let's please remember that always) are described as seeming short on time, short on patience and in my opinion also short on precise memory. But what they collectively say is that the swimming photo is real indeed. And that it was taken on April 4th of 2014. So on the very day that Osman was lured to the Caldera area - the Chiriquicito River more precisely - by Milagros to meet up with the very Pandilla who had been threatening him in the days prior (according to Osman and Margarita) and was killed there by being hit on the head. So this is a real photo indeed. Just as the NFI and Dutch prosecution declared in their more recent Cold Case treatment of the disappearance case of Kris and Lisanne. But that it are not Kris and Lisanne pictured. I had to laugh when I read who they claim are pictured here. Standing on the right are Murgas and Jorge, they say. Crouching in the water are Milagros and her friend Sandra C.. So we are supposed to believe that the figure that looks exactly like Lisanne, is in fact Milagros.... Find the 1000 differences:
Milagros = Lisanne, Sandra C = Kris
And compare this photo of Milagros and Sandra "XiXi" C., taken on August 14th of 2014, with the figures in the swimming photo... Either the Pandilla are taking the mickey out of the two German authors, or they all collectively think their audience is blind or stupid? Because no offense, but Milagros looks nothing like that Lisanne type of figure. Nothing... Same for Sandra C. not resembling Kris whatsoever. These are 99,9% not the same women. Different skin colour, different hair colour, different body size and weight, very different facial features. Are they taking Annette for a ride? In fact, when Annette talks to Sandra C. she also cannot believe it is her who is pictured next to Milagros (which was Milagros' decided version of events). "She recognizes the others, the same as Milagros and Henry. What she doesn't remember, however, is whether she is the person next to Milagros. "It could be me," says Sandra and explains the crux of the photo: "You can't recognize the faces. But I remember exactly that I was in a few of the photos back then." She shrugs her shoulders. "But in this one? I really can't say for sure." - Neither can anybody else, I reckon. Bizarrely enough, the book authors seem completely content with this quick and sincere explanation though. They don't ask too many critical questions. Instead they write about how everybody else out there simply 'think the wrong thing' for believing we see Lisanne here (with her pale skin and lighter brown hair and broad smile and apple cheeks) and Kris (with her striking red hair and cream and peaches skin).
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It becomes even more bewildering when Alba C, another friend of the Pandilla clique, says that it is in fact not Sandra C. who is standing in 'Kris's place, but Osman Valenzuela 🤣 Milagros and Osman are arm in arm standing deeper in the water. Annette also scratches her head initially, but then quickly adds that "the photo is so distorted and blurred that you can interpret anything and everything in it." Group friend Xinia P. also says that the figure with seemingly red hair is in fact Osman Valenzuela. Standing next to 'Milagros' in the water, who is making a V-sign. When Jorge G. is also confirming that he is the one with the black cap on, yes, and that in the water are Milagros and Osman, Annette is sold. "There's hardly any doubt in my mind now. No one has colluded here, nor has anyone tried to pull the wool over my eyes." OK then...
Paranormal activity
Annette is told that this swimming photo was taken by Xinia P. with her tablet, together with a whole series of other swimming photos. All of which showed inexplicable distortions, blamed on supernatural stuff. Because that is probably one way to explain away the total absence of ANY resemblance between these people and the swimming photo figures. Quote from the book: "But," says Sandra C., lowering her voice. "There is something mysterious about this photo." She then talks about silhouettes that are said to have been visible in the swimming photo and in other pictures from that afternoon. "Similar to ghosts, something paranormal," she says. "Our people with blurred faces and unrecognizable." Annette continues: "In my mind, I dismiss this statement because I don't believe in paranormal phenomena. But a few days later, my skepticism matures when I meet with the lawyer who investigated the circumstances of Osman's death to find out more. He also tells me about unexplained apparitions and outlines in the photos." Xinia P. also tells Annette: "There were these strange phenomena on all of them, Osman's face was always altered, strangely twisted or even completely unrecognizable." She had never experienced anything like it before. "That's why they talked about it for a long time among friends." - So the grainy quality of the photo is explained away here because it was spooky and 'strange' that day and all the photos turned out distorted, due to paranormal activity lol. Not because we are dealing with a big bunch of coordinated lies here by the Pandilla people.
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But then the biggest bummer of all. So the Pandilla friends all claim to have taken many more photos during that swimming event on April 4th, the day that Osman died there from a violent attack by someone.... But due to bad luck, those other swimming photos no longer exist. Nobody has them anymore, even though they must have captured the very last living moments of their dear friend Osman... Because the tablet no longer exists. It broke down. And nobody apparently ever received a single copy of those pictures. Oh what a shame. There is no way anymore now to verify these claims of paranormal photo distortions in the rest of the supposed swimming photo series... Annette writes about this in their book: "Of course, I immediately want to see the other photos and ask Xinia about them. However, she says that she has since disposed of her tablet because it broke. She hadn't saved the pictures on it." Annette: "Unfortunately, we have not been able to find the other photos from April 4, 2014. What is behind these claims? It's a specific peculiarity in the Kris and Lisanne case. No sooner has one secret been revealed, than another pops up."
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So ALL of these supposed other swimming photos are gone now, as Xinia P's tablet was disposed of without saving the photos and apparently nobody else saved them either 🧐🤔 But we just have to believe their claims that it are them all in the one surviving photo and not Kris and Lisanne, because... they all coordinated their statements more or less? Despite us having no other photos, no text messages of that day that confirm that it were them in fact who were even at that place on April 4th 2014. No evidence shown of phone calls made that day, in order for us to see if cell tower pings were made to their respective phones. No copies shared of the police files regarding Osman's death, confirming that these Pandilla friends were named as witnesses in Osman's death on April 4th. In light of the importance of the specific angle of the sun and shade (that afternoon?) seen in the one surviving swimming photo, I would have also liked to hear from these friends at what time of day that photo was exactly taken? Heck, why aren't we shown its EXIF data that prove that it was indeed taken on April 4th? And not a few days prior for instance.. Where was Osman even, according to his "friends", if not captured in the photo? They all tell the same details about him going behind a rock to relieve himself, never to be seen alive again. They were all there they claim, but it must be that paranormal cloud that was hanging around that day, which swallowed Osman up when he went behind that rock and spat him out somewhere in the river. Who believes this nonsense? Well I know who do.. And why do these people, supposed friends of Osman, mostly blabber about who is in the photo, but not talk about the highly suspicious death that very day, ruled an unsolved homicide? They were there, so who killed him? We still don't know. How chilly, how bizarre. But all this does not seem to worry Annette one bit, or make her doubt this uniform answer from the gang. It is case closed people, when it comes to the swimming photo. The authors declare that "mysterious photo" to be totally explained satisfyingly now. Nothing to see here 😊 And the authors sound incredibly confident that their absurd eyesore 'identification' of Milagros and Sandra or Osman in that swimming photo is the solution of this swimming photo ID.. Maybe because they did not provide photos of Milagros and Sandra in their book? Well, I can. I honestly do not understand in what sort of world this is is supposed to be clear evidence. Does everybody need glasses?
I'm not saying that this part of the investigation is sub-par, but it leaves a lot to be desired and therefore certainly is not enough to "debunk" the swimming photo theory. Not by a long mile. I haven't read everything in detail yet in the new book, but I don't even know how - with all the other photos being 'lost' - the authors even explain THIS one swimming photo surviving and resurfacing in the package of leaked case photos which Juan received from the two Canadians? They simply don't even try to explain that. From what I read in the book Still Lost in Panama, the authors also unearthed good bits of info about the investigation. I don't want to give off the impression that it is a big nothing burger book. I will in due time definitely write a long, separate evaluation post about this 2024 book publication. Some new case details are revealed, also about the investigation and Pitti's errors. Just, their handling of the pandilla, the swimming photo and the tour guide leaves something to be desired I think, and raises questions about their motive for doing so. But more on that in due time.
Update 2022: Martin Ferrara O'Donnell has left some disgruntled facebook messages below Mariana's social media posts about the podcast
Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell: "The Dutch did not climb any path please, what was the danger, do not invent, the Dutch did not die on the mountain, but well Jeremy and I are the ones who have been working on this project since 2018, Jeremy did an investigation for which I I contacted him, Mariana came to appear for the filming, I don't think I should pretend that this was his project or that it was born from his experiences, I must be honest and I cannot allow people to be deceived in this way."
Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell: Neither Jeremy nor Mariana are the investigators, let's be serious, I did the investigation in Panama, on the forced disappearance of the Dutch girls, I sold my investigation to a California company, for which Jeremy was my contact, let's be honest, Mariana She is not the main figure of this research work, for me she was just a pretty face in the production, another thing in my opinion she really cannot have knowledge of the facts, when Jeremy and I had been working on this idea for four years, which at first was mine, because of my interest and need for the truth to be known, the merits should go to who deserves them, I ask when she was threatened in Boquete, that was her invention and that was how it was understood by everyone Those of us who work on this production in Boquete, Mariana, please tell things as they really are, they got nothing out of going to a mountain if the young Dutch women never climbed a mountain, I have the truth, the commitment with the company was to make my research known, but I think I was deceived...
Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell: "Jajaja, no fue trafico de órganos, no fue crimen organizado, no fue contactada por el gobierno, no resuelve nada, me pregunto por qué Mariana quiere dar una idea errada de lo que pasó con las jóvenes holandesas, ella ni nadie puede cambiar los hechos no puede darle el matiz que le da la gana solo para vender, las jóvenes holandesas murieron en manos de unos inadaptados, los hechos son como fueron y ella no los puede cambiar, creo que esta joven se salió del marco de la verdad de los hechos y además es oportunista e inventora, la corrupción no ha sido identificada en estos hechos, pero si se puede señalar una mala investigacion de parte de las autoridades competentes, le pregunto a Mariana, con cuál autoridad ELLA habló en Panamá, espeto que la verdad sea conocida y esto no es la verdad....es un mal concepto de la realidad de los hechos."
Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell: "Hahaha, it wasn't organ trafficking, it wasn't organized crime, it wasn't contacted by the government, it doesn't solve anything, I wonder why Mariana wants to give a wrong idea of what happened to the Dutch girls, she and no one else can change the facts she can't give it the nuance she wants just to sell, the young Dutch women died at the hands of some misfits, the facts are as they were and she can't change them, I think this young woman stepped outside the framework of the truth of the facts and she is also an opportunist and inventor, corruption has not been identified in these events, but if a bad investigation by the competent authorities can be pointed out, I ask Mariana, with which authority SHE spoke in Panama, I hope the truth is known and this is not the truth....it is a bad concept of the reality of the facts."
Elizabeth Muñoz: "Mariana Atencio tengo una pregunta: ¿cuando investigó lo de las 50 mujeres desaparecidas en él área? Si ni quiera piso más de dos semanas Boquete. Se nota que le gusta sacar méritos propios con trabajos ajenos. Así como habla del valor y respeto por la mujer etc y lo que hace en persona es todo lo contrario." "Mariana Atencio I have a question: when did you investigate the 50 disappeared women in the area? If you don't want to stay in Boquete for more than two weeks. You can tell that she likes to get her own merits with other people's jobs. Just as he talks about the value and respect for women, etc., and what she does in person is the opposite."
Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell: "Elizabeth Muñoz exactamente y yo estuve alli, yo lo vi y lo viví, Mariana según entiendo fue a entrevistar, ella nunca jamás investigó algo en Boquete, sobre la muerte de las holandesas ni de nadie más, no entiendo por que inventar y darse atributos y hechos que no son ciertos, hago constar, yo vivo en Boquete y junto con Jeremy llevamos este proyecto adelante, no sé y no entiendo por qué Mariana alegremente, sin escrúpulos ni vergüenza, quiere proyectar esa imagen que no le corresponde y tampoco se la ganó." "Elizabeth Muñoz exactly and I was there, I saw it and lived it, Mariana, as I understand it, went to interview, she never, ever investigated anything in Boquete, about the death of the Dutch women or anyone else, I don't understand why they invent and give themselves attributes and facts that are not true, I state, I live in Boquete and together with Jeremy we carry out this project, I do not know and I do not understand why Mariana happily, without scruples or shame, wants to project that image that does not correspond to her and she did not earn it either."
Maitê Mendonça: "Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell es verdad que la region tiene 50 mujeres desaparecidas?" "Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell Is it true that the region has 50 missing women?"
Martin Eduardo Ferrara O'Donnell: "Hola, no es cierto, Mariana no dijo la verdad en ese aspecto, Chiriqui y Bocas Del Toro no tienen ese problema." "Hello, it is not true, Mariana did not tell the truth in that regard, Chiriqui and Bocas Del Toro do not have that problem."
--Surprising to read these some critical Facebook messages from Martin O'Donnell... Considering how extensively his theory seems to be covered in the podcast, and to which extent he appears to have corroborated with Kryt for this investigation. It appears as if Martin beliefs that Mariana made up the death threat episode. He also appears to have some issues with Mariana being the face of this podcast, believing it were himself and Jeremy Kryt who did all the actual investigation. I don't know if that is true. He also says not to believe (or to know) that Kris and Lisanne died up the mountain. And that the Californian company who he collaborated with, did not do justice to Martin's precise findings and theory. He feels deceived about this. He thinks that the podcast gives some wrong facts, for instance that there are 50 missing women in the region. As I interpret it, Martin says this is incorrect and Mariana may have brought this info anyway, because missing Latina women is a topic close to her heart, about which she wanted to also talk in the podcast. I guess it is true that Mariana merely summed up some broad general numbers about missing women in the region. Numbers which can be even challenged as they were not backed up by concrete sources, or by case specifics. There were no public Facebook responses to Martin's comments by either Mariana or Jeremy. He made them some months ago already.
Let us remind ourselves what we do know about Martin O'Donnell's beliefs. I have no access to his entire file but some details have been leaked in the various media. A private detective, Martín Ferrara O'Donnell, was hired by several expats in Boquete to investigate what may have happened to Kris and Lisanne. He continued the searches after the payments stopped and is said to believe that Kris and Lisanne were murdered and dismembered. Osman Valenzuela and José Manuel Murgas were both also victims of the same (local) criminal youth gang he believes, which also consists supposedly of the often mentioned/described local psychopath youngster. One of them has a red truck. Martin also believes that Kris and Lisanne partied and slept in a hut beyond the summit of the Mirador on the night of April 1st. It lies on a road towards Boquete Tree Trek, where Henry worked at that time. It was supposedly on the way back down to Boquete on April 2nd that some of the daytime photos were taken. He also believes that the camera times and the chronological order of the photos have been messed with at a later time. And what's more; just like Juan he believes that some photos were taken at Piedra de Lino (near the hostel of Pedro, where the girls were reportedly seen by several witnesses) and not on the Pianista trail, but that the photos were messed with to create a fake 'innocent afternoon walk turned accident' narrative. He also believes that the girls received a fateful lift that day. A friendly get together with local male youth, where alcohol and drugs were later introduced, turned at some point into a dangerous situation for the Dutch women. O'Donnell believes that both Jose Manuel and Osman were murdered. All four young people in the swimming photo were victims in all this. He is also not convinced that Kris and Lisanne called the emergency services themselves on April 1st and beyond. The taxi driver Leonardo was not a murder victim according to the detective.This of course makes me wonder what Martin O'Donnell Ferrara believes EXACTLY. Erik Westra was given info by Ferrara apparently which links to this mango tree in Cuervo's garden as the burial site of Kris and Lisanne. 'Ferrara says that there is a road through the Tree Trek park that leads very near to the house where Kris and Lisanne partied in the night of April 1 to 2. Tree Trek is not close to the Pianista Trail, in fact it is a stiff walk from there.' As I understood it later, Ferrara believed that Kris and Lisanne partied in a shed behind the Mirador. Not at Cuervo's house in Palo Alto. I am not sure to be honest what exactly he believes or said to have happened, in detail. And whether or not his stories have been consistent in this respect. We do not have his case files as he asked a good sum of money for it at some point. Which seems fair to me, considering Pitti asks money as well for interviews and some authors ripped off freely available information from myself and others to put their biased, one-sided version of (Pitti's) events in a terrible publication, making money off this case, against the explicit wishes of the parents. With regards to O'Donnell's work: we have to trust that Kryt and Mariana properly represented his findings. He is complaining that they didn't. We can't be sure however that he has been consistent over time with his specific, detailed beliefs. Or maybe he was, and Kryt and Atencio took some elements from his theory - the ones that coincide with Margarita's story - but not all elements? And did some cherry-picking in that respect? To simplify the story presented? (Which would equal slight manipulation perhaps?) Although we have been given narrative variations in the podcast as well:
- Margarita says Kris and Lisanne ended up in Cuervo's house (so in an inhabited zone near Boquete).
- Martin O'Donnell says they ended up in a cabin/shed in the middle of nowhere, behind the Mirador.
- And the Alto Romero guide says they ended up in Alto Romero in a place owned by guide F, were they were kept alive and were abused for some days, before being killed.
We cannot be sure which of the three version is correct, or whether none of them are correct perhaps. (Or all of them are somehow correct). We cannot uncover ourselves what the truthful narrative is. We don't even know with certainty whether Margarita was purely telling us what Osman told her himself, or if she perhaps told a combined version of testimony from her son, and Murgas. Or from Osman, Murgas and Martin Ferrara O'Donnell... We also cannot be sure at this point if the story of others in town may be diluted versions of Margarita or Martin's original stories, or not. We can only highlight the info provided by the podcast makers and others who spoke out in this case. But all these versions also have significant overlaps in details. Which is interesting, so many years after the fact. The discovery of the Pata de Macho trail seems also of great importance here to me. Confirmed by other people who were interviewed including their guide. And as Dave M. wrote me: let's also not forget that Kryt uncovered the previously unrevealed original Police statements from guide F., with some incredible revelations in them! And the police files that confirm that Osman was murdered in fact. And the police files that confirmed that Murgas did speak to police about the case. And that Pitti made unwanted files go away....
A great new video of Juan,
covering the podcast
In this interview, Mariana Atencio later says:"During our investigation, we came across government corruption, possible drug trafficking, even mentions of organ and human trafficking. Without giving too much away, I will tell you that my life was directly threatened, which had never happened before, even while covering cartel-related violence in Mexico or crackdowns against protests in China or Cuba. Everyone on our crew – including our indigenous guides and local support – risked their lives to find out what happened to these young women. This story is that explosive in Boquete. A dirty little secret everyone theorizes about. They refer to it in hushed tones and many won’t dare grant you an interview about it in broad daylight." "As the team dug into what happened to Kris and Lisanne eight years ago, we found more than 50 cases of missing women and girls in that same 40-mile corridor of Panama. Femicide – extreme violence and murder of women based on their gender – is so rampant in Latin America it has been labeled a “shadow pandemic” by the United Nations. At least one third of women in Latin America and the Caribbean have experienced some form of violence from men, according to the most recent stats from the World Health Organization. In northern Panama where the women went missing the numbers are alarming, especially for an area that’s considered a mecca for expats and tourists. As a Latin-American woman, I had to find out what happened to Kris and Lisanne, but also shed more light on this epidemic of violence against women in our hemisphere and within our communities." "While we were on the ground in Panama, another woman – Stephanie Rodriguez – went missing. Her body was later found in a dumpster. We made a point to interview her husband, Ilich Leon. He was so afraid to speak openly, we had to conduct the interview in the back seat of our car in a parking garage. A man with a strong physique, I still remember the tears of helplessness rolling down Leon’s cheeks as he held a framed photo of Stephanie in his hands. After that, my priorities shifted during this investigation. I reconnected to the struggles of everyday people and got back to boots on-the-ground reporting in places far from the headlines. Maybe I had stopped doing it because of the pandemic – there was certainly no possibility of doing this kind of story during quarantine – or maybe that was the lie I told myself while I was lost?" "This case helped me deal with past trauma and regain my purpose. I felt uniquely prepared for it, speaking my native Spanish on assignment, while translating to English for our audience. I channeled my empathy as a Latina and used my fearlessness and physicality to get answers."
August 29th 2023
Jeremy Kryt published 'Behind Lost In Panama: Q&A with Jeremy Kryt'. He explains some of his motivations for making the podcast series Lost in Panama, which I summarized and covered in detail in this separate blog post. Thanks Power-Pixie for pointing me to this Q&A.A few interesting quotes from Kryt: "At that time the case was under active investigation, and the prosecutor, Bethsaida Pitti, still considered homicide a potential explanation. Later Pitti would change her mind and unequivocally rule that the women were “dragged to death” in the Culebra River. That might be true, yet the fact that a serious and officially sanctioned homicide investigation was never undertaken baffles people to this day, including the cops who worked the case and still suspect foul play might have occurred. They wanted to dig more, but claim they were blocked by Pitti and her staff."
Kryt: "It’s clear that the federal police officers who initially worked the case are concerned the girls’ deaths might well have been the result of a double murder committed by a small group of young men from Boquete. They also suspect that at least three other people were killed to keep them from talking to the authorities about the deaths of Kris and Lisanne. Those officers independently identified the same alleged suspects our other sources pointed to—they’re even mentioned in the original police report—but for unknown reasons, the prosecutor at the time (Pitti) never followed up on this nor interrogated the young men in question." "An authorized investigation into the suspects might very well clear up the mystery. For example, they could be found to have iron-clad alibis that would rule them innocent—and thus indicate the women were more likely to have died in an accident. On the other hand, a confession, subpoena-ed cell phone records, and/or contradictory testimony from individual members of the group could bring their guilt to light."
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The Travel Channel has produced and aired a TV program called 'Lost in the Wild' on Travel Channel and Hulu, and the first episode that aired on December 29th 2019 is about the Kris and Lisanne case!
Juan and I have been contacted by someone from this channel, a little while ago, for information. We couldn't provide more than we both already have written and talked about in blogs/youtube videos etc, but we're both super happy that despite so many people coming with plans for such things, the Travel Channel actually has delivered! The episode that airs Sunday December 29th at 11pm/10c on Travel Channel and Hulu. Below are two teaser clips, which were uploaded today on youtube. I cannot wait to watch it tonight! The trailers show how these two investigators went to Boquete and flew with a helicopter into Alto Romero, unannounced, to talk to the woman who found the backpack of Kris and Lisanne. They also talked to witnesses and at least one is put on camera while requesting to stay anonymous and unrecognizable. And that is only what we can determine from these two teaser trailers. This is promising to be a great show tonight and at the very least we will all see exactly what the area behind the Pianista looks like! What the area where the bones were found looks like, the rivers behind the Mirador and the hamlet of Alto Romero will also be highlighted properly. And besides that, I have hopes for perhaps more revelations. Exciting. See more on the two hosts and their program concept here. And I'll try to record the episode and somehow upload it somewhere.
Some stills from the trailers:
Flight by helicopter to Alto Romero
Update
Nicely made program! I summarize everything in this blog post (scroll down to the 2nd half of it). A few good specialist mini interviews (Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot, quoted here numerous times, as well as the anonymous pathologist who investigated the girls' bones), mixed into a trek beyond the Pianista Trail, going all the way to the first cable bridge. Including an overnight stay in the jungle. And the husband of the woman who found the backpack makes a startling statement. And one guess about who showed up first on camera, casually passing the presenters with some tourists on the top of the Mirador: exactly, a tour guide. I guess he had to make sure that he was the first person to see what these American TV-makers were doing up his mountain. Which seems typical, considering he was involved in every step of this investigation so far, short of doing the actual autopsies. And the fact that the TV makers decided to keep him in the show may also not be a coincidence. I won't reveal everything about this video yet, in order not to spoil it for you, because I'm trying to upload the entire video in good quality on youtube now, but not sure it will be able to stay up. Otherwise I will upload the video in parts on my vimeo channel. You can also view the whole episode here 
Summarizing, these are the most important findings and quotes I got from the show
The makers and "veteran explorers" J.J. Kelley and Kinga Philipps did a really good job I thought, in showing us viewers what Boquete looks like; what the Pianista trail looks like, which sheds you pass on the way up. And of course they went further than most others have done so far when reporting on this case: they slept beyond the Mirador summit and they walked to the first cable crossing, even showing us on camera how long it takes to get there and how feeble these ropes are and how totally illogical it was at that point and stage to decide to walk over them. And to then both fall off and drown, according to the Panamanian officials.. This theory seems even more illogical than ever before, now that we have seen this footage. Sure thing, there were a couple of dramatized and staged cringey 'cliffhangers' in the show, such as the sound of cracking branches in the dead of night (wouldn't be surprised if that was their camera man, trying to create some buzz for the episode), or the 'near fall' of Kinga from the rope bridge (seemingly just her pretending to slip). And they sensationalized things a bit with spooky mysterious music here and there. But those are just innocent directors tricks I think, to keep this show thrilling to not just the small legion of Kris and Lisanne 'fan boys and girls' out there. Meaning; everyone who is searching the net for more and more and more info on this case. So what really were great additions in my opinion, were the short interviews incorporated in the show. Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot - more often quoted in these blog posts - showed up and spoke with pathos and a bit of drama about the dangers of the river crossings and about his suspicions of what really went on there. Criminologist Octavio Calderón made his appearance (he is also quoted elsewhere in my blog posts), as well as the same anonymous pathologist specialist who was also interviewed by top notch Panamanian journalist Adelita Coriat while doing the autopsy research on the bones and skin from the girls (you can find his forensic findings in this blog post when you scroll down to the subheading 'Three interesting and important Panamanian news articles from the fall of 2014'). Then Sinaproc rescue specialist Verisimo Fuentes was also shortly interviewed. Read more about this episode here.
The makers and "veteran explorers" J.J. Kelley and Kinga Philipps did a really good job I thought, in showing us viewers what Boquete looks like; what the Pianista trail looks like, which sheds you pass on the way up. And of course they went further than most others have done so far when reporting on this case: they slept beyond the Mirador summit and they walked to the first cable crossing, even showing us on camera how long it takes to get there and how feeble these ropes are and how totally illogical it was at that point and stage to decide to walk over them. And to then both fall off and drown, according to the Panamanian officials.. This theory seems even more illogical than ever before, now that we have seen this footage. Sure thing, there were a couple of dramatized and staged cringey 'cliffhangers' in the show, such as the sound of cracking branches in the dead of night (wouldn't be surprised if that was their camera man, trying to create some buzz for the episode), or the 'near fall' of Kinga from the rope bridge (seemingly just her pretending to slip). And they sensationalized things a bit with spooky mysterious music here and there. But those are just innocent directors tricks I think, to keep this show thrilling to not just the small legion of Kris and Lisanne 'fan boys and girls' out there. Meaning; everyone who is searching the net for more and more and more info on this case. So what really were great additions in my opinion, were the short interviews incorporated in the show. Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot - more often quoted in these blog posts - showed up and spoke with pathos and a bit of drama about the dangers of the river crossings and about his suspicions of what really went on there. Criminologist Octavio Calderón made his appearance (he is also quoted elsewhere in my blog posts), as well as the same anonymous pathologist specialist who was also interviewed by top notch Panamanian journalist Adelita Coriat while doing the autopsy research on the bones and skin from the girls (you can find his forensic findings in this blog post when you scroll down to the subheading 'Three interesting and important Panamanian news articles from the fall of 2014'). Then Sinaproc rescue specialist Verisimo Fuentes was also shortly interviewed. Read more about this episode here.
So not everything was covered in this show, but the presenters did highlight the bottlenecks of the investigation: the timing of the first two distress calls; the location where they could have been if they had kept walking beyond the Mirador. They confirmed that around the time when the first emergency phone calls were made on day 1, Kris and Lisanne could have categorically been nowhere near the first monkey bridges; that much is proven without a doubt now. They also highlighted the missing photo 509 and they used the exact same Canon camera as the girls to show that when you manually delete a specific photo and then take new photos, that the next new photo automatically gets the file numbering of the previously deleted photo. In other words: if Kris and Lisanne truly had deleted the original photo 509 themselves and then continued to take the nighttime photos on April 8th themselves with this same camera, then we would have never even known that there ever was another photo 509. The first nighttime photo would then have received the number 509. This tells us that photo 509 was deleted AFTER the nighttime photos were made. Which in turn strongly points towards a 3rd person who got rid of the photo. (Unless you believe in an accident, then none of this is evidence of the contrary I think). Perhaps because the girls managed to make a shot of their attacker(s)? The presenters also showed that these wonky cable bridges are far from inviting to pass. ("That is not a bridge: that is a wire" There is no way the girls made it out this far before making that distress call"). And that there is a very very small chance that Kris and Lisanne actually decided to cross them, instead of just turning around and returning on the one distinct trail back to Boquete. Which is exactly what most youtubers and bloggers and other followers of this case have stated all along. The presenters also stress that the location of the first monkey bridge over the Serpent River is many hours away from the point of photo 508; they know it because they just walked it themselves. They had to have an overnight stay in order to reach the first river crossing and monkey bridge the next day. So to think that the girls made it to the monkey bridge on the first day, during daylight, is as good as debunked. If they did walk on to this river then they would have arrived there after dark on the first day. Then I was stunned that the presenter team managed to get in contact with the woman who found the backpack: Irma Mirando and her husband Luis Atencio allowed for a short interview, in the hamlet of Alto Romero, of which we now have precise map locations and imagery. The knockout revelation made by this local woman Irma and her husband, is that they looked at the enlarged and brought along photos 507 and 508 of Kris passing the small stream (or so the editing wants us to believe, we cannot be sure which photo the couple respond to as it is not explicitly shown to us in the same moment), and stated - after first having consulted their tribe members in hushed tones - that this spot is NOT on the Continental Divide. It is not located beyond the Mirador summit, they say, but instead on the Boquete side of the mountain. This was very surprising, because all along we have heard and even seen in the video made by Kris' parents, that you reach that stream when you walk onward from the summit, for an hour or so. Didn't we see with out own eyes here that it is beyond the summit? So everyone has it wrong there? I am not so sure to be honest that this couple is telling the truth. Didn't we already see that the screenshot stills taken that the Kremers video corresponds with the location of photos 507 and 508? You can make up your own mind about this, here are the photos:
Comparison of the first stream beyond the summit as the TV crew found
it, with photo 508 of Kris (I think THEY were at the wrong spot, possibly):
[On the right here photos from Power-Pixie, who made composites of still images from Hans Kremers' video and the Lost in the Wild video 5 years later, and placed them on top of photo 508]. - But such streams as in photos 507 and 508 can be found on other parts of the trail too perhaps, and during the time the parents from Kris went there, at the start of August and only a few months after the girls went missing, the place already looked quite different if you ask me, as shown in the above photos with only mild guesses for "matching stones", which often don't fully match at all. Any selection of rocks alongside a small stream could probably look similar over there. Makes me also wonder how this man can even remember what that stream looked like in April of 2014, so more than five and a half years ago, when these photos show just how much that stream can change in appearance within just a few months, once the rain season starts and the rivers swell. With the changing water volume it is very hard to be certain therefore. I always felt that the crossing pictured by Kris' parents in that video really WAS the same as in photos 507 and 508. Yes, some stones moved or got dislodged, but some specific looking stones were still present. And the manner in which the trail winds up in the background also seems to match. I think it's the same location, also look at the similar stones on the left, next to the stream coming down. That is a match, if you take into consideration that there was less water floating when Kris and Lisanne walked there. The girls had been there during a very dry period, just before the raining season started. And there even was an earthquake on day 2 of their ordeal. Quite a bit away, more towards the city of David, but still, very noticeable in this area. So well, why would the Alto Romero couple be so staunch about the crossing being on the Boquete side of the mountain instead? After having first had a short village vote about something? Maybe to make sure that no more interviewers come down to their side of the mountain in helicopters? You guys need to be on the Boquete side, now go away again! - In fact, I just compared the entire photo 508 with another shot from the Kremers video Looking for Kris, and I am fully convinced now that the stream behind the summit of the Pianista Trail, the one which Kris' parents also identify as the same place where photos 507 and 508 were taken, is (in my opinion at least) 100% certain the right place. Because just look at the little trail and the specific way in which it leads upward after the stream itself. It matches perfectly. Also, look at the big diagonal slope of rock with moss, left from the back from Kris; it is also visible in the Kremers video. This is the same spot, no doubt about it. And this spot is therefore not on the Boquete side of the Pianista Trail; meaning it is not before the Mirador summit (where the girls took all their happy selfies), but in fact an hour or so after you keep walking onward from the summit.
And here are two photos from Toni B. on this subject:
I quote Romain further down this blog post who went to Boquete and walked the Pianista trail. He commented about the Alto Romero couple's comment that photos 507 and 508 were supposedly taken at the Boquete side of the mountain: “In this report we can see a native of Alto Romero village claiming that photo 508, and therefore the last normal photo of the girls, was actually taken between the Mirador and Boquete. This statement does not make sense since when you enter the jungle from the Boquete side, there is only one river that you cross three times. None of these crossings correspond to photo 508. I take the liberty of raising this remark because this report has created many doubts among Internet users.” - Another thing that has always struck me is how the girls did not take a photo (as far as we know) of the super photogenic and slightly creepy wall off stone and moss. The TV makers did shoot footage of it, but there is no known photo from the girls of this place, which they would have passed fairly soon after deciding to continue walking on the summit. Here it comes:
To me it does look like the girls walked beyond the summit and took some photos at this first stream. The subsequent rainy season may have contributed to some shifting about of those rocks. Then I think they could have in fact turned around and returned to the summit (extra photos were taken there, now with a clouded background, which were later mixed by a 3rd party with the previously made summit photos with a near blue sky). And after that they were seen by several witnesses at or around 15:30pm at the base of the mountain again. I know that we're in subjective territory now, but I dedicated part 1 of this blog mostly to the main facts and some mild interpretation. And by now I just include my personal beliefs about what most likely in my opinion - but not certainly - has happened. They probably went for a swim then with their potential killers I think, and were taken by those people who gave them a lift to or from the swimming spot. - But back to this Travel Channel episode; the implication of what these two residents of Alto Romero say, (unless we got the definition of 'the Boquete side of the mountain' collectively all wrong) is that Kris and Lisanne never even were behind the Mirador. Not on April 1st and certainly not on April 8th, when those nighttime photos were taken with their camera. If that is true, we can wonder if the search troops and the officials and the families were tricked into spending mostly all their resources, helpers, dog teams and funds to comb through this stretch of nature behind the Il Pianista Trail (when in fact the girls were never there). Now, that is something which I myself and many others have stressed all along as well. So to now hear it from these villagers, who know those trails like the pocket of their trousers, is interesting. More doubts and possible gaslighting. Someone else who underlined this, were the people who got interviewed:
Those interviewed
Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot also stressed that "There is no way to get lost. You actually don't need a guide." And with regards to the official theory that the girls fell both off a monkey bridge and washed away, Van de Goot said: "No way. They would never ever go on it." When Kinga mentioned to Frank that "this area has a bit of a reputation", he replied: "Yes, I know". Kinga: "There are other people who have gone missing here." Frank: "Yes, correct." And criminologist Octavio Calderón says about this: "There's hundreds of cases like that." Van de Goot also says: "When you're looking at the Pianista Trail, there are little farms everywhere. There is no way not to be noticed up there. You are actually passing through people's backyard." Kinga: "So you do think they were alive for several days after they disappeared?" Frank: "Yes, unfortunately yes." Kinga: "What do you think went on in the girls' head at this point?" Frank: "Waiting, yes. Panic, yes. Fear, yes." Kinga: "What about the photos from the camera? There were 90+ photos taken..of just random things.." Frank: "Yes. I saw them. They are creepy. They're Blair Witch Project. The part of the jungle out there is known by the guides as 'jungle hell'. Past the Continental Divide... people die, up here." [..] "When you are out there in daylight, there is no problem. When you are out there in the dark, it's game over." "You haven't seen the cable bridges. I'm a mountaineer; you're full mortal on that bridge." Kinga: "That's the official story from the government: that they fell from these bridges." Frank: "No way." Kinga: "You don't believe that?" Frank: "No way. No way. Because they would never ever go on it." Kinga: "Why, because it's so hazardous?" Frank: "Because they're sensible girls." JJ: "What would happen if you fell off of one of these bridges?" Frank: "Uhm.. first you break your neck, second you break your neck, third you break your neck and then you fall in the water and break your neck." JJ: "You're dead." Frank: "Yeh, quite." *Foot note: it was a bit surprising (but a good surprise) to hear Frank van de Goot now state that he thinks the girls did not have an accident on the monkey bridges. He himself has initially been leaning toward an accident. Not just on Dutch tv, but also in this interview with Jeremy Kryt. He said at the time that “You can’t really exclude a crime, but I remain [of the opinion] it was an accident scenario.[..] I can’t completely exclude a crime, but I have nothing to prove that. With an accident, there are a few possibilities, but I can’t prove it.” Would have been nice to also hear him explain what exactly he now thinks díd happened to them. And if he still believes that Kris and Lisanne could have fallen in a ravine, as he initially stated. I did not appreciate how Frank van der Goot changed his story over time, especially once interviewed by the Lost in the Wild crew. He sounded overly dramatic there, as if he wanted to impress Kinga or something. I don't like that sort of exaggeration by a scientist. Over the top statements like: "Uhm.. first you break your neck, second you break your neck, third you break your neck and then you fall in the water and break your neck." JJ: "You're dead." Frank: "Yeh, quite." - It showed me that he likes to create some effect with his words, instead of being clean and concise in his analysis. It also makes me weary about other stuff he wrote and said. For instance, initially he was convinced that these girls fell down a very specific ravine with a river crossing down the bottom. He said this in the media on several occasions, but never provided the hard evidence of this specific ravine, despite having been at the Pianista trail himself. One does not come up with such theories unless there is evidence of the existence of such a ravine, at a spot that was not searched by Sinaproc. 
Sinaproc rescue specialist Verisimo Fuentes said that it is not logical to get lost on the Pianista Trail: "No, not at all. There is only one road."
Criminologist Octavio Calderón: "We know that by 16:39 they start calling and something is wrong." When Kinga asks him about the other missing person cases in the area he answers: "Yes, there are hundreds of cases like that."
The woman who found the backpack. Irma Mirando and her husband Luis Atencio allowed for a short interview, in the hamlet of Alto Romero. Her husband explained that "when we found that evidence, we didn't want to talk about it because those girls were human beings, just like us. We don't want to remember it anymore." The translator who came along added that the villagers said that a lot of time has passed since this happened and they really aren't keen to relive what happened back then. Also, one of the things where the villagers of Alto Romero have been really resentful about, is the fact that at one point when this first started, there was an offering for a 30.000 dollar reward. For those who found the girls. And they are the only ones who found evidence. But nothing has been paid to them.. So the villagers are still very suspicious of anyone coming to them and telling them to do something for them, because when there was a reward offered, they were the only ones who found things and no money has ever come through. To which Kinga says rightfully and respectfully that it makes her mad for them, on their behalf. Luckily the couple do decide to talk to JJ and Kinga in the end. They say this: "My husband and I walked down to the river. I was going to wash clothes and bathe myself. And when I approached the edge of the river, I saw what looked like a backpack from the distance, trapped in between the rocks on the edge of the river." Her husband said that when they handed the backpack in to the authorities, he called a nearby cattle rancher (identified later as a tour guide) and informed him what he had found. He called the border police then and handed the backpack "directly over to the police". When Kinga showed the couple the photos 507 and 508, Luis says that those were taken "over at the Pianista. On the other side of the divide"*. He says that they were taken on thát side, not on their side. So on the Boquete side of the Continental Divide. This means that if what he says is true, Kris and Lisanne reached the summit at the Continental Divide, and then turned back. ("So how did their stuff get in the river, if the girls never made it there?") Footnote: The bag and all its content was also video recorded - supposedly by the middleman or this woman although it may have been Betzaida Pitti for all we know - and publicized in the media. The bag was even said to have been washed first by this woman, something which she doesn't mention in this interview, so it may be untrue. This claim may perhaps have been brought into the world initially to come up with an attempt at an explanation for the mostly clean and dry state in which the backpack was found. Of course that made zero sense, considering the thing was said to have been carried by the river and having spent 2 months supposedly in the rain season battered jungle. Oh and update on the reward matter: here it is stated that the parents flew to Alto Romero at some point to explain to the villagers that the 30.000 dollar reward was meant for those who brought the girls back alive. They settled the matter by offering to patch up the local children's school of Alto Romero, instead of paying out the 30.000 dollars. But despite agreeing with this, the locals seem still cranky about this 'deal' in 2019.. *I wonder if we truly know what their definition is of "over at the Pianista. On the other side of the divide". Perhaps for the inhabitants of Alto Romero, a lot further up north, this still includes the trail beyond the Mirador? 
Anonymous forensic pathologist: When asked if he was the one who actually, physically, worked with the bone fragments from Kris and Lisanne, he answers: "That's correct. I'm an expert in the study of human remains. I figured out that the bones were fragments from the right rib, a left pelvis, the tibia, femur and a right foot" [Scarlet: photos of the found boot show a left foot and a left boot..]. Kinga asks if the fragments found are consistent with the story of bodies being broken up by a river. The anonymous forensic pathologist answers: "No. The state of the remains do not indicate that the victims fell in the river. When a human falls in a turbulent body of water, several breaks [fractures] immediately occur. Especially in the pelvis, the cranium [part of the skull] and the long bones." Kinga asks: "And you didn't observe that in the remains?" The answer: "No." About the officials statements that these girls fell from a bridge ("nothing more than a hypothesis") being unfound and never having been actually proved whatsoever, he says: "That's correct. In my opinion there is a murderer still out there. This information is based on my experience living in Mexico. When I worked in Mexico, part of my job involved closing down several labs associated with organ trafficking. I recently believe these girls were drained [all vital organs were removed], then later their bodies were dismembered and disposed of." He also confirms that it is correct that it is in the interest of Panamanian officials to keep this crime quiet, in order to protect tourism. But.. I have a hard time believing that organ trade was involved, mostly because it would have been a hard thing to pull off secretly and because it would require medical facilities and such. Although Dorian also has a point when he writes: "Hmm, well Panama is on the border with Costa Rica, where there is an international organ-trading business going on, where kidneys are sold for more than 20 dollars. They are transit countries, linked both north and south and connecting to nations with very serious cartel groups. Brazil lies in the south; and Mexico to the north. This is what makes Panama (and Costa Rica) as a nation interesting; as it acts as a chain, or link, to the drug/sex industries. Panama City is proof of this, with kidnapped women routinely ending up there to drive demands. So why can't organ trafficking take place in Panama? It can, and it does. We simply don't know what happened to these girls after they went to Il Pianista. [..] Certainly, the pathologist who worked with the bones seems to think the few remains align with draining techniques, which suggested, to him at least, that organ removal had taken place. If there were no places in Panama, for example, to extract organs and/or safely deposit them for transportation, or even if there was no demand in the area(s) for sales, then I doubt this pathologist would have publicly mentioned this possibility. He would have logically dismissed it, but he didn't... "
I made a short video in which all these specialist statements have been put together, here you can listen to it for yourself. Also Juan's review of this show:
On the Travel Channel's facebook page I read the first comments under the trailers of this series episode, and there were a couple of armchair survival specialists already bitching about the show not being specialized enough, or not doing more in depth research and relying on sensationalism. I don't agree with that myself, I think they did a great job and unearthed some new clues and info which - again - (and perhaps only in my opinion) point towards foul play, rather than an accident. They interviewed the right people also; especially the anonymous scientist. This man did all the forensic autopsy investigation of the bones. He is an authority. A while ago I posted the entire articles about these autopsies, further down this blog post. If he says there is no physical, scientific indication on any of these remains of an accident, a fall, animal scavenging etc, then he is most likely the only person to be believed in this. Big respect to him for not being silenced. Some say he is dodgy for only testifying anonymously, but I think that in itself tells us how dangerous it is over there to go against the official verdict and to unearth truths that officials want to keep hidden. There have been many more reports about the bodies of Kris and Lisanne having been dismembered. So yeh, on the Travel Channels social media channels the mindless bashing of this show has already started 😄 Typical.. Kinga and JJ also did a great job. They were unlikely to find The Truth; the program showed exactly how hostile, suspicious and unwilling the atmosphere in Boquete is. Very few people were willing to help them. But word about their arrival - camera team and all - did go round like wildfire. I wasn't expecting them to cover the entire case in all its details, because look at this ogre of a blog post series; it grows into a 4 headed monster in no time; there are simply too many facts, too many details, too many story arcs to cover when you want to do it completely. They'd need more than one hour for that. And commercial TV does not have the luxury of droning on and on and on, like I do. They need to wrap things up at some point, and only touch the highlights. There were some staged cliffhangers added to the show at times (the pretend near-fall off a cable bridge, the noises at night) but at the end of the day, this is a commercial channel who went to great lengths to go to Boquete, show us the trail, show us Alto Romero and to interview a couple of important people in this case. I am happy with the result, it was very interesting. 
In the end, these two presenters may not be 'certified state official' investigators, but I thought they did a great job. And what's more, they bring a lot of attention to this case, which it really needs in order to make even a chance to ever be solved. The specialists they managed to interview were interesting and have all done their fair share of research in this case. I understand that their trimmed down analysis of foul play is going to make a lot of Accident gospelers go in an instant spasm, but the forensic science in this case has always pointed to foul play, and not to an accident. We all know by now that there is a lot of smoke and fog and misinformation, as well as critical omissions in the available information. Which is probably why this case is still discussed by people to this extent. And frankly I don't even 100% believe the couple who was interviewed in Alto Romero. Who says they are telling the whole truth? Most villagers looked pretty pissed off, and were upset that they never received the reward money from the families. Which is a very sad state of affairs. And they first had a village meeting about the whole interview.... Who knows whether or not they were instructed to say this to JJ and Kinga. So that the whole media circus can now jolly move far away from them, to the other side of the mountain. Who is to tell whether or not they told the complete truth to a bunch of hipster Americans with a camera man, traveling in a helicopter? Or if they correctly interpreted the comment about the Boquete side of the mountain. Either way: great show. Thank you Travel Channel!
When I found out a year ago that there is so much more to this disappearance case than two girls who got lost and perished, and that the nighttime photos and the phone logs had all been made public, I was surprised how little detailed information was known in the English speaking section of the internet. So I wrote these blog posts based on kilometres worth of forum info, newspaper articles, documentaries, all in Dutch or sometimes in Spanish. I just wanted some English written online files where all this information was gathered in one place. with the near complete story, as it is known now. Juan is a fellow Dutchie who I got to know in the online world over a shared interest in this case. He is savvy with video making and likes to brainstorm in all different directions. I am not good at making videos and focus on this written blog mainly, as well as translating existing videos. We are both excited that the Travel Channel contacted us a while ago and now actually has made this Lost in the Wild show. And there appear new podcasts and youtube videos every week it seems, helped by all this English information on the case; the more people know about it the better. It's only 6 years or so ago that the girls disappeared and there are so many open questions still. I do still hope there will be a breakthrough at some point in the future. May even be someone on their death bed with more information, who wants to speak up, who knows. I’m also hoping for a sequel episode from the Travel Channel at some point, including the swimming photo in their reporting and all the new intel the show makers may now receive from locals and American expats etc (well, there is always hoping..).
When I found out a year ago that there is so much more to this disappearance case than two girls who got lost and perished, and that the nighttime photos and the phone logs had all been made public, I was surprised how little detailed information was known in the English speaking section of the internet. So I wrote these blog posts based on kilometres worth of forum info, newspaper articles, documentaries, all in Dutch or sometimes in Spanish. I just wanted some English written online files where all this information was gathered in one place. with the near complete story, as it is known now. Juan is a fellow Dutchie who I got to know in the online world over a shared interest in this case. He is savvy with video making and likes to brainstorm in all different directions. I am not good at making videos and focus on this written blog mainly, as well as translating existing videos. We are both excited that the Travel Channel contacted us a while ago and now actually has made this Lost in the Wild show. And there appear new podcasts and youtube videos every week it seems, helped by all this English information on the case; the more people know about it the better. It's only 6 years or so ago that the girls disappeared and there are so many open questions still. I do still hope there will be a breakthrough at some point in the future. May even be someone on their death bed with more information, who wants to speak up, who knows. I’m also hoping for a sequel episode from the Travel Channel at some point, including the swimming photo in their reporting and all the new intel the show makers may now receive from locals and American expats etc (well, there is always hoping..).
Update: the presenter from the Lost in the Wild episode wrote this below one of Juan's videos on youtube about this episode: J.J. Kelley7 hours ago@Juan thank you! It's my hope that this story opens the possibility to a future episode as well. We'd worked hard to obtain the original memory card, but the family didn't wish to grant access. I respect this decision very much—the family's wishes are always paramount in each case—but I do feel we could bring closure to this case by analyzing the camera's memory card. Our hope was to offer the memory card to a top data recovery specialist to find the missing photo and further analyze the raw photos. The last time the Dutch government looked at that card was years ago, and recovery technology has come a long way. I do think there are answers on that card. Thank you again and I look forward to sharing future episodes of "Lost in the Wild." - Quite a shame that neither the families nor the officials are willing to reopen anything or share the evidence, at this stage. The parents from Kris have fought for years for more justice, better investigation and further truth searching, but there was a shift in all this recently. They are entirely entitled to this and have all the sympathy in the world from everyone I think, they must do what is best for them. But unfortunately the Dutch officials are closing everything off as well and refuse to reopen the case, despite multiple requests. And nobody is sharing these pieces of evidence for further investigation. [Update, Betzaida Pitti will co-author a book in the spring of 2021 and she will share all that info; the official case reports, the official photo files. Against the families' wishes, but that doesn't stop commercial authors]. Someone else, P., wrote me that he knows a top IT specialist who had told him that Kris' Iphone - even the 4 series - saves all the GPS data somewhere on a microchip for at least 10 months. Even with a dead battery. Even with a deactivated tracker and even without a connection on the mobile network, or when out of range of any antennas. Apparently this is similar for a Samsung Galaxy. He wrote: "so if the phones can be checked by a specialist in Holland, this will answer lots of questions, it will show the track of the phones." 
I want to post many screen prints I took from the show. Because it is not often that investigators walk so far down the wilderness, away from the summit of the Pianista Trail. I read on Dutch forums how people offered money, back in the early days of this disappearance, to go to Boquete and record their hike down this path. Only so the Dutchies on the other side of the ocean could see with their own eyes what it really looks like there. Not much came from those attempts, but now we have a really good video available through this show of the Pianista trail, going all the way to the first river crossing. Excellent. The show also had countless great shots of the Boquete area, the mountains, the people living there, the monkey bridges, and so on. I will order the images chronologically and thematically. Consider it a visual way of storytelling. This blog post has been written at the start of 2020, but in order to have it appear more neatly in chronological order within this blog, where I like readers to first see part 1 - the main story -, I added a later publication date after a good portion of my blog had disappeared and needed to be reuploaded in late March of 2021.
The Pianista Trail
Kris and Lisanne reconstructions
Maps of the area
*****
Alto Romero
The specialists who were interviewed
Tonight, Sunday December 29th at 11pm/10c on Travel Channel and Hulu: an episode from the Travel Channel, called 'Lost in the Wild', about the Kris and Lisanne case!
Juan and I have been contacted by someone from this channel, a little while ago, for information. We couldn't provide more than we both already have written and talked about in blogs/youtube videos etc, but we're both super happy that despite so many people coming with plans for such things, the Travel Channel actually has delivered! The episode that airs Sunday December 29th at 11pm/10c on Travel Channel and Hulu. Below are two teaser clips, which were uploaded today on youtube. I cannot wait to watch it tonight! The trailers show how these two investigators went to Boquete and flew with a helicopter into Alto Romero, unannounced, to talk to the woman who found the backpack of Kris and Lisanne. They also talked to witnesses and at least one is put on camera while requesting to stay anonymous and unrecognizable. And that is only what we can determine from these two teaser trailers. This is promising to be a great show tonight and at the very least we will all see exactly what the area behind the Pianista looks like! What the area where the bones were found looks like, the rivers behind the Mirador and the hamlet of Alto Romero will also be highlighted properly. And besides that, I have hopes for perhaps more revelations. Exciting. See more on the two hosts and their program concept here. And I'll try to record the episode and somehow upload it somewhere.
Some stills from the trailers:
Flight by helicopter to Alto Romero
Update Nicely made program! A few good specialist mini interviews (Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot, quoted here numerous times, as well as the anonymous pathologist who investigated the girls' bones), mixed into a trek beyond the Pianista Trail, going all the way to the first cable bridge. Including an overnight stay in the jungle. And the husband of the woman who found the backpack makes a startling statement. And one guess about who showed up first on camera, casually passing the presenters with some tourists on the top of the Mirador: exactly, tour guide F. I guess he had to make sure that he was not only the first person to see what these American TV-makers were doing up his mountain, but also to be the first to feature in the program, which is typical considering he was involved in every step of this investigation so far, short of doing the actual autopsies. And the fact that the TV makers decided to keep him in the show may also not be a coincidence. I won't reveal everything about this video yet, in order not to spoil it for you, because I'm trying to upload the entire video in good quality on youtube now, but not sure it will be able to stay up. Otherwise I will upload the video on the blog.
You can view the whole episode here.
Now summarizing, these are the most important points, findings and quotes I got from the show:
The makers and "veteran explorers" J.J. Kelley and Kinga Philipps did a really good job I thought, in showing us the viewer what Boquete looks like; what the Pianista trail looks like, which sheds you pass on the way up. And of course they went further than most others have done so far when reporting on this case: they slept beyond the Mirador summit and they walked to the first cable crossing, even showing us on camera how feeble these ropes are and how totally illogical it was at that point and stage to decide to walk over them. And then both fall off and drown, according to the Panamanian officials.. Seems more out of the question than ever before, now that we have seen this footage. Sure thing, there were a couple of staged 'cliffhangers' in the show, such as the sound of cracking branches in the dead of night (wouldn't be surprised if that was their camera man, trying to create some buzz for the episode), or the 'near fall' of Kinga from the rope bridge (clearly just her pretending to slip). And they sensationalized things a bit with spooky mysterious music here and there. But those are just innocent directors tricks I think, to keep this show thrilling to not just the small legion of Kris and Lisanne 'fan boys and girls' out there. Meaning; everyone who is searching the net for more and more and more info on this case. So what really were great additions, were the short interviews incorporated in the show. Dutch famous pathologist Frank van de Goot - often quoted in these blog posts - showed up and spoke with pathos and a sense of drama about the dangers of the river crossing and his suspicions of what really went on there. Criminologist Octavio Calderón made his appearance (he is also quoted in these blog posts), as well as the same anonymous pathologist specialist who was also interviewed by top notch Panamanian journalist Adelita Coriat while doing the autopsy research on the bones and skin from the girls (you can find his forensic findings in this blog post when you scroll down to the subheading 'Three interesting and important Panamanian news articles from the fall of 2014'). Then Sinaproc rescue specialist Verisimo Fuentes was also shortly interviewed.
So not everything was covered in this show, but the presenters did highlight the bottlenecks of the investigation: the timing of the first two distress calls; the location where they could have been if they had kept walking beyond the Mirador (and around the time of calling they were categorically nowhere near the first monkey bridges; that much is proven without a doubt now). They also highlighted the missing of photo 509 and they used the exact same Canon camera as the girls to show that when you manually delete a specific photo, and then take new photos, that the next new photo automatically gets the file numbering of the previously deleted photo. In other words: if Kris and Lisanne truly had deleted the original photo 509 themselves and then continued to make the nighttime photos on April 8th themselves with this same camera, then we would have never even known that there ever was another photo 509; the first nighttime photo would then have received the number 509. The fact that it didn't, tells us that photo 509 was deleted AFTER the nighttime photos were made. Which in turn strongly points towards a 3rd person who got rid of the photo. Perhaps because the girls managed to make a shot of their attacker(s). The presenters also showed that these wonky cable bridges are far from inviting to pass and that there is a very very small chance that Kris and Lisanne actually indeed decided to cross them, instead of just turning around and returning on the one distinct trail back to Boquete. Which is exactly what most sane youtubers and bloggers and other followers of this case have stated all along. Most of what was said by the presenters has been stated all along in fact. The presenters also stress that the location of the first monkey bridge over the Serpent River is hours away from the point of photo 508; they know it because they just walked it themselves. So to think that the girls made it to the monkey bridge on the first day, during daylight, is ludicrous. ("That is not a bridge: that is a wire" There is no way the girls made it out this far before making that distress call"). Then I was stunned that the presenter team managed to get in contact with the woman who found the backpack: Irma Mirando and her husband Luis Atencio allowed for a short interview, in the hamlet of Alto Romero, of which we now have precise map locations and imagery (matching what I have published on this blog about it all along). The knockout revelation made by this local woman, Irma, and her husband, is that they looked at the enlarged and brought along photos 507 and 508 of Kris passing the small stream, and stated without any doubt that this spot is NOT on the Continental Divide. It is not located beyond the Mirador summit, they say, but instead on the Boquete side of the mountain. This was very surprising, because all along we have heard and even seen in the video made by Kris' parents, that you reach that stream when you walk onward from the summit, for an hour or so. Didn't we see with out own eyes here that it is beyond the summit? So everyone has it wrong there? I am not so sure to be honest that this couple is telling the truth. Didn't we already see that the screenshot stills taken that the Kremers video corresponds with the location of photos 507 and 508? You can make up your own mind about this, here are the photos:
Comparison of the first stream beyond the summit as
the TV crew found it, with photo 508 of Kris (I think THEY were at the wrong spot, possibly):
But such streams as in photos 507 and 508 can be found on other parts of the trail too perhaps, and during the time the parents from Kris went there, only a few months after the girls went missing, the place already looked quite different if you ask me, as shown in the above photos with only mild guesses for "matching stones", which often don't fully match at all. Any selection of rocks alongside a small stream could probably look similar over there. Makes me also wonder how this man can even remember what that stream looked like in April of 2014, so more than five and a half years ago, when these photos shows just how much that stream can change in appearance within just a few months? With the changing water volume and the rain seasons, it is very hard to be certain therefore. I always felt that the crossing pictured by Kris' parents in that video (pictured above here) really WAS the same as in photos 507 and 508. Yes, some stones moved or got dislodged, but the manner in which the trail leads up afterwards and such do seem to fit? I think it's the same location, also look at the similar stones on the left, next to the stream coming down. That is a match, if you take into consideration that there was less water floating when Kris and Lisanne walked there. There was way more water running down when the Kremers went there because they went in August of 2014, after or during a raining season spell. The girls had been there during a very dry period, just before the raining season started. So well, why would the Alto Romero couple be so staunch about the crossing being on the Boquete side of the mountain instead? After having first had a short village vote about something? Maybe to make sure that no more interviewers came down there in helicopters? You guys need to be on the Boquete side, now go away again! - In fact, I just compared the entire photo 508 with another shot from the Kremers video Looking for Kris, and I am fully convinced now that the stream behind the summit of the Pianista Trail, the one which Kris' parents also identify as the same place where photos 507 and 508 were taken, is 100% certain the right place. Because just look at the little born trail and the specific way in which it leads upward after the stream itself. It matches perfectly. Also, look at the big diagonal slope of rock with moss, left from the back from Kris; it is also visible in the Kremers video. This is the same spot, no doubt about it. And this spot is therefore not on the Boquete side of the Pianista Trail; meaning it is not before the Mirador summit (where the girls took all their happy selfies), but in fact an hour or so after you keep walking onward from the summit.
Another thing that has always struck me is how the girls did not take a photo (as far as we know) of the super photogenic and slightly creepy wall off stone and moss. The TV makers did shoot footage of it, but there is no known photo from the girls of this place, which they would have passed fairly soon after deciding to continue walking on the summit. Here it comes:
So even when you compare the video footage of the parents from Kris passing this small stream, the 1st quebrada as they call it, you can see that there are some striking changes also in the location and shapes of the stones between these photos/video stills, which were taken within just a few months time difference. Could it be that the Alto Romero couple is correct and that the location where Kris stands in photos 507 and 508 is indeed a completely different stream passing from the one you can find after the summit of the Pianista trail? One which nevertheless resembles the one in the video of the parents? Hmmmm.. I'm not sure tbh. To me it does look like the girls walked beyond the summit and took some photos at this first stream. The subsequent rainy season may have contributed to some shifting about of those rocks. Then I think they did in fact turn around and returned to the summit (extra photos were taken there, now with a clouded background, which were later mixed by a 3rd party with the previously made summit photos with a near blue sky). And after that they were seen by several witnesses at or around 15:30, at the base of the mountain again. They probable went for a swim then with their potential killers, and were taken by those people who gave them a lift to or from the swimming spot. - But back to this Travel Channel episode; the implication of what these two residents of Alto Romero say, is that Kris and Lisanne never even were behind the Mirador. Not on April 1st and certainly not on April 8th. When those nighttime photos were taken with their camera. Someone has tricked the search troops and the officials and the families into spending mostly all their resources, helpers, dog teams and funds to comb through this stretch of nature behind the Il Pianista Trail, when in fact the girls were never there. Now, that is something which I myself and many others have stressed all along as well. So to now hear it from these villagers who know those trails like the pocket of their trousers, as we say here, is very interesting. More lies and deceit from the Panamanian officials, that much is certain. Someone else who underlined this, were the people who got interviewed:
Those interviewed
Dutch pathologist Frank van de Goot also stressed that "There is no way to get lost. You actually don't need a guide." And with regards to the official theory that the girls fell both off a monkey bridge and washed away Van de Goot said: "No way. They would never ever go on it." When Kinga mentioned to Frank that "this area has a bit of a reputation", he replied: "Yes, I know". Kinga: "There are other people who have gone missing here." Frank: "Yes, correct." [..] "When you're looking at the Pianista Trail, there are little farms everywhere. There is no way not to be noticed up there. You are actually passing through people's back yard." Kinga: "So you do think they were alive for several days after they disappeared?" Frank: "Yes, unfortunately yes." Kinga: "What do you think went on in the girls' head at this point?" Frank: "Waiting, yes. Panic, yes. Fear, yes." Kinga: "What about the photos from the camera? There were 90+ photos taken..of just random things.." Frank: "Yes. I saw them. They are creepy. They're Blair Witch Project. The part of the jungle out there is known by the guides as 'jungle hell'. Past the Continental Divide... people die, up here." [..] "When you are out there in daylight, there is no problem. When you are out there in the dark, it's game over." "You haven't seen the cable bridges. I'm a mountaineer; you're full mortal on that bridge." Kinga: "That's the official story from the government: that they fell from these bridges." Frank: "No way." Kinga: "You don't believe that?" Frank: "No way. No way. Because they would never ever go on it." Kinga: "Why, because it's so hazardous?" Frank: "Because they're sensible girls." JJ: "What would happen if you fell off of one of these bridges?" Frank: "Uhm.. first you break your neck, second you break your neck, third you break your neck and then you fall in the water and break your neck." JJ: "You're dead." Frank: "Yeh, quite."
*Foot note: it was a bit surprising (but a good surprise) to hear Frank van de Goot now no longer state that he thinks the girls had an accident. When initially he was leaning more toward an accident. Not just on Dutch tv, but also in this interview with Jeremy Kryt. He said at the time that “You can’t really exclude a crime, but I remain [of the opinion] it was an accident scenario.[..] I can’t completely exclude a crime, but I have nothing to prove that. With an accident, there are a few possibilities, but I can’t prove it.”
Sinaproc rescue specialist Verisimo Fuentes said that it is not logical to get lost on the Pianista Trail: "No, not at all. There is only one road."
Criminologist Octavio Calderón: "We know that by 16:39 they start calling and something is wrong." When Kinga asks him about the other missing person cases in the area he answers: "Yes, there are hundreds of cases like that."
The woman who found the backpack. Irma Mirando and her husband Luis Atencio allowed for a short interview, in the hamlet of Alto Romero. Her husband explained that "when we found that evidence, we didn't want to talk about it because those girls were human beings, just like us. We don't want to remember it anymore." The translator who came along added that the villagers said that a lot of time has passed since this happened and they really aren't keen to relive what happened back then. Also, one of the things where the villagers of Alto Romero have been really resentful about, is the fact that at one point when this first started, there was an offering for a 30.000 dollar reward. For those who found the girls, dead or alive. And they are the only ones who found evidence. But nothing has been paid to them.. So the villagers are still very suspicious of anyone coming to them and telling them to do something for them, because when there was a reward offered, they were the only ones who found things and no money has ever come through. To which Kinga says rightfully and respectfully that it makes her mad for them, on their behalf. Luckily the couple do decide to talk to JJ and Kinga in the end. They say this: "My husband and I walked down to the river. I was going to wash clothes and bathe myself. And when I approached the edge of the river, I saw what looked like a backpack from the distance, trapped in between the rocks on the edge of the river." Her husband said that when they handed the backpack in to the authorities, he called a nearby cattle rancher (Scarlet: this was tour guide F.) and informed him what he had found. He called the border police then and handed the backpack "directly over to the police". When Kinga showed the couple the photos 507 and 508, Luis says that those were taken "over at the Pianista. On the other side of the divide". He says that they were taken on thát side, not on their side. So on the Boquete side of the Continental Divide. This means that if what he says is true, Kris and Lisanne reached the summit at the Continental Divide, and then turned back. ("So how did their stuff get in the river, if the girls never made it there?")
Anonymous forensic pathologist: When asked if he was the one who actually, physically, worked with the bone fragments from Kris and Lisanne, he answers: "That's correct. I'm an expert in the study of human remains. I figured out that the bones were fragments from the right rib, a left pelvis, the tibia, femur and a right foot" [Scarlet: photos of the found boot show a left foot and a left boot..]. Kinga asks if the fragments found are consistent with the story of bodies being broken up by a river. The anonymous forensic pathologist answers: "No. The state of the remains do not indicate that the victims fell in the river. When a human falls in a turbulent body of water, several breaks [fractures] immediately occur. Especially in the pelvis, the cranium [part of the skull] and the long bones." Kinga: "And you didn't observe that in the remains?" The answer: "No." About the officials statements that these girls fell from a bridge ("nothing more than a hypothesis") being unfound and never having been actually proved whatsoever, he says: "That's correct. In my opinion there is a murderer still out there. This information is based on my experience living in Mexico. When I worked in Mexico, part of my job involved closing down several labs associated with organ trafficking. I recently belief these girls were drained [all vital organs were removed], then later their bodies were dismembered and disposed of." He also confirms that it is correct that it is in the interest of Panamanian officials to keep this crime quiet, in order to protect tourism.
I made a short video in which all these specialist statements have been put together, here you can listen to it for yourself. Also Juan's review of this show:
On the Travel Channels facebook page I read the first comments under the trailers of this series episode, and there were a couple of armchair survival specialists already bitching about the show not being specialist enough, or not doing more in depth research. I don't agree with that myself, I think they did a great job and unearthed some new clues which - again - point towards foul play, rather than an accident. They interviewed the right people also; especially the anonymous scientist. This man did all the forensic autopsy investigation of the bones. He is an authority. A while ago I posted the entire articles about these autopsies further down on this blog post. If he says there is no physical, scientific indication on any of these remains of an accident, a fall, animal scavenging etc, then he is most likely the only person to believe in this. Big respect to him for not being silenced. There have been many more reports about the bodies having been dismembered, it is also what is spread around in talking in Boquete. So yeh, on the Travel Channels social media channels the mindless bashing of this show has already started 😄 Typical.. But anyone who has put the time into reading up on this case should at the very least feel some reasonable doubt by now regarding the 'official reading' of drowning. Kinga and JJ also did a great job. They were unlikely to find The Truth; the program showed exactly how hostile, suspicious and unwilling the atmosphere in Boquete was, when they walked around and asked for information. Very few people were willing to help them. But word about their arrival - camera team and all - did go round like wild fire, and it is not a surprise to me that tour guide F. made his appearance very early on, checking out 'his mountain' with prying eyes. So anyway, I wasn't expecting them to cover the entire case in all its details, because look at this ogre of a blog post series; it grows into a 4 headed monster in no time; there are simply too many facts, too many details, too many story arches to involve when you want to do it completely. They'd need more than one hour for that. And commercial TV does not have the luxury of droning on and on and on, like I do. They need to wrap things up at some point, and only touch the highlights.
In the end, these two presenters may not be 'certified state official' investigators, but I thought they did a great job. And what's more, they bring a lot of attention to this case, which it really needs in order to ever be solved. The specialists they managed to interview were interesting and have all done their fair share of research in this case. I understand that their trimmed down analysis of foul play is going to make a lot of Accident gospelers go in an instant spasm, but the forensic science in this case has always pointed to foul play, and not toward an accident. Also, as you can read a bit further down this blog post, new photos have recently surfaced and were posted by Juan, showing the girls swimming in the nearby Caldera area, in what seems to be the later afternoon. Considering nothing was written about it by either of them in previous days in their diaries, there is a good chance that this took place on April 1st 2014 and that this was in fact their last daytime photo. It would mean that the Alto Romero couple was right in this and that they did walk back down the mountain again that day, something which is also confirmed by several witnesses. We all know by now that there is a lot of smoke and fog created by state officials and investigators; there is clearly an element of not wanting bad press for their important local tourism industry. And frankly I don't even 100% believe the couple who was interviewed in Alto Romero. Who says they are telling the whole truth? Most villagers looked pretty pissed off, and were upset that they never received the reward money from the families. Which is a very sad state of affairs. And they first had a village meeting about the whole interview.... Who knows whether or not they were instructed to say this to JJ and Kinga. So that the whole media circus can now jolly move far away from them, to the other side of the mountain. So who is to tell whether or not they told the complete truth to a bunch of hip Americans with a camera man and traveling in a helicopter? By the way, we didn’t even see which photo they showed the couple exactly. Either way: great show. Thank you Travel Channel! I’m hoping for a sequel at some point, including the swimming photo and all the new intel the show makers may now receive from locals and American expats etc (well, there is always hoping..).
Notice also the person who seems to record everything with a cellphone
Родителям Крис и Лисанн в личной беседе без права разглашения скажу , что на самом деле произошло с их девочками
ReplyDeleteОткуда вы знаете? Удалось ли вам с ними связаться?
Deleteахаха без права разглашения это очень смешно. кто вы такой чтобы ограничивать их права?
DeleteHi Scarlet,
ReplyDeleteDid you notice that after 5.12 minutes, Kinga started her timer at the base of the mountain? They had reached the summit within 2 hours (1 hours 58 minutes to be exact). When comparing it with the girl's timeline according to digital CANON camera, I have few doubts. We know that at least 30 photos were taken that day and the first photos were near the bridge at the start of the trail around 11.16 a.m. (Assuming photos 479 and 480 show the side views from the bridge)
This video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzAOL7uTzQ8 from part 3 shows the trail from the beginning to near the base of the Pianista trailhead. If we assume the average speed of the bike as 30 km/h (8.3 m/s), the simple math would give an approximate distance around 3.5km-4km from the beginning to the base of the trailhead.(Correct me if you know the exact distance). If we consider the average walking speed of a person as 5 km/h, it would take nearly 45 minutes of continuous walk to cover that distance. But we know that at least on 3 occasions, they had paused during their walk to take photos.
If we calculate the time interval between photos 481 and 491 (photo of Kris in the middle of their ascent), it is nearly 45 minutes (47 minutes to be exact). It means they had already walked from the bridge to the base of the Pianista trailhead and further walked half the distance from base to the summit. Very unusual rate of walking for a casual hike, specially on unknown terrain without guides. It is true that the weather was perfect for hiking that day and they would walk faster than the rainy day like in the documentary, but covering that amount of distance within 45 minutes doesn't add up. It further doubt your mind, when you see the photos that had been taken as they reached the Pianista summit. Because with such a pace, they had reached the summit without even breaking a sweat in a hot and humid weather conditions.
If the photo 481 shows the base of the Pianista trailhead at 11.16 a.m, then the timeline of Kinga and girls can be correlated. Otherwise it makes lot of doubts in your mind if you carefully follow the timeline. What do you think?
One other thing, Did you notice the guy with the red t-shirt record the interview between Luis and Irma at Alto Romero? My personnel feeling is that both L and I were speaking nervously during the interview and looks like L knows more than he speaks. In fact, the comments made by him regarding the location of photo 508 is doubtful.
Regards.
Only recently aware of this tragedy. Obviously gaping inconsistencies in the official narrative, and whilst speculative, totally suspect foul play. These women stepped into sketchy scenario, arrived in a town to teach Spanish, despite neither being a linguist or fluent in Spanish (psych studies and social education studies), to be immediately told they were not needed for a week. This is where danger began, being idle and disgruntled, with empty week to pass in wholly unfamiliar, regional, cultural environment. Being young they quickly began to socialize with others their age, and seeking ways to pass the week. This involved meeting young men their age at local club, as they had previously done. Had just spent previous weeks in the company of two male Dutch tourists, for meals, drinks, beach etc. Whilst fellow Dutch tourists were something of known quantity, men and culture of this regional town were not.
ReplyDeleteMain point here is to focus less on lost hiker narrative and more on what other activities they were doing, when and with whom. Is claimed they went swimming with the local young men they met. Sequence of hiking and swimming is not very clear, claims and times again contradictory. Now stay with me on this. Having gone swimming around the time of their disappearance (late in the day) would give most logical answer for two nagging but critical details, as to why both their bras were neatly folded in backpack, and why Kris' denim shorts also neatly folded, as described when both subsequently 'found', allegedly at separate and distant jungle sites. Surely, if they went swimming this is what they would do with personal clothing items at time. Whereas, is quite clear that whenever they actually did go hiking, they were wearing bras in the images on the camera.
Thus, did something go horribly wrong when socializing at the swim hole, with local young men they had barely met? Did the men begin to make increasingly aggressive sexual advances toward these foreign women as they were stripped down in the water together? And, did that spiral way out of control?
Was the official 'lostl' narrative quickly strung together in next days, to cover up and hide the real role and identity of the perpetrators of foul play at the swimming hole? The camera's sequence of hiking images ended very abruptly, with Kris standing over stream, but that may not have been the actual last image of the day, any further images may have simply been deleted by whoever was in subsequent possession of the camera. With intent to remove and manipulate any visual record the women had returned from the stream, and completed the hike back to the trailhead, with any further images and tag numbers being deleted during the delete roll back. This would be 'curating' images to fit the 'lost' narrative. That they had wandered off from stream, never to be seen again, despite fact there was clear and well trodden path-line. The addition of some ninety night flash images that tell almost nothing, from over a week later, lend themselves to the extension of this 'curating' of the camera's imagery to fit the lost narrative.
In short, what if they went hiking, finished, met up with local young men for a post hike swim, late in the day (it was warm weather) and the young men became inappropriate, assaulted, and either abducted or murdered them? The time stamps in the official narrative are all contradictory, and camera data also looks unreliable, the official timeline looks highly manipulated (verbally and technologically) to meet the preferred official narrative.
This intended as working suggestion - but perceive the the hike/swim order and timetable as the crucial issue, and the key to all this is detail of neatly folded bras in backpack, and neatly folded denim shorts. This shouts sequence is one of hike earlier in day and swim later in day. Ergo, whatever horrific and tragic events transpired, it likely occurred at the swim hole with the local young men.
The last three real photos indicate palpable tension and unease and Lisanne is photographing Kris from greater distances, possibly to try and record significant landmarks, or even just slow their forward movement down. They had been intercepted either from below on the main trail, or from a hidden side pathway (or both). They were wearing strong colors and would have been visible at medium distances through various lower density sections of trail. It's just intuitively obvious another presence had arrived, and shortly thereafter they lost the ability to record events with camera. The growing tension was from intrusion, as the girls are hiding their fear and the perpetrator(s) are hiding their aggression, but it was just below the surface, yet to be fully revealed, and humans are highly evolved to sense these things for survival. Being pressured or coerced off the trail, was a fatal mistake, they were marginally safer on the trail, as the intruders would have had to attack in the open, and further had to deal with bodies in the open if they intended to commit sexual assault with likely escalation to murder. Even if this was always going to end in capital murder, it would have been better chance for them, and provided some material or forensic evidence for their families, to have had events played out in the open terrain, not concealed in some distant shanty house with a yard for burial. Final note, in the video of the parents on the trail looking to retrace daughter's steps - the Guide F tells the son not to speak about something, would wager he meant the hidden side trails, one of which the sharp eyed mother manages to notice anyways.
ReplyDelete